is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

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Stiftung Haeschentest

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Stiftung Haeschentest on Thu Sep 23, 2010 1:45 pm

Ä wrote:

Schürrle , Holtby, Gündogan, Götze, Kimmel, Rudy ...


Who's that?

scratch

We could do with a few quality full backs IMO but other than that we indeed are well stocked with talents at the moment.
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Matt_AFC

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Matt_AFC on Thu Sep 23, 2010 5:03 pm

Hows mats hummels playing recently? seen him playing for dortmund previously and thought he looked like a decent player.

stinger

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by stinger on Thu Sep 23, 2010 6:27 pm

Stiftung Haeschentest wrote:
Ä wrote:

Schürrle , Holtby, Gündogan, Götze, Kimmel, Rudy ...


Who's that?

:s
That's what I want to know as well Laugh
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Ä

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Ä on Thu Sep 23, 2010 6:43 pm

Stiftung Haeschentest wrote:
Ä wrote:

Schürrle , Holtby, Gündogan, Götze, Kimmel, Rudy ...


Who's that?

scratch
.

Whistle Biggrin

you are quite right

his REAL name is KITTEL



http://www.spox.com/de/sport/fussball/nachwuchs/1009/Artikel/sonny-kittel-interview-eintracht-frankfurt-talent-b-jugend-meister-alexander-schur-michael-skibbe-erster-einsatz-profi-kader-real-madrid-podolski-oezil.html

Eintracht Frankfurt's JEWEL

Ale

also don't forget about Sebastian JUNG

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Stiftung Haeschentest

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Stiftung Haeschentest on Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:33 am

Does Sonny even play in the Bundesliga yet? He looked very good on youth level, that's true, but it's still too early to tell if he's going to make it on a higher level as well.
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Stiftung Haeschentest

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Stiftung Haeschentest on Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:34 am

Mr Vermaelen wrote:Hows mats hummels playing recently? seen him playing for dortmund previously and thought he looked like a decent player.

He made a huge blunder against Karpaty in the EL and looked a bit shaky in the first few minutes against Schalke but other than that he has been as solid as it gets this season.
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Stiftung Haeschentest

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Stiftung Haeschentest on Fri Sep 24, 2010 11:44 am

On a related note to that, I hope Löw finally increases the competition for places in the central defence. Hummels has been very consistent defensively for two years now and offers so much more offensively than someone like Mertesacker for example. It's no coincidence IMO that several teams have tried to force Merte into the playmaker role for Germany knowing that his build-up from the back is comparatively mediocre. Hummels (or Höwedes/Boateng for that matter) are much more comfortable on the ball. The accuracy and regularity of Hummels' long-range passes for instance is simply superb.
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Allez les rouges

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Allez les rouges on Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:34 pm

Right, but would you already argue for Merte to be dropped?! Or Hummels to be in pole position to partner him ahead of Badstuber (with Friedrich out)?

It's true, at the WM 2006 I hoped/expected Mertesacker to be among the top defenders in the world come the last WM but what with injuries, slowness etc he became solid rather than exceptional. But we have fewer areas of genuine experience than we have had at times and he remains an important player for me...
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Allez les rouges

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Allez les rouges on Fri Sep 24, 2010 12:48 pm

You seen this on "the boys" in the SZ Hase? Hype much?

http://www.sueddeutsche.de/sport/bundesliga-borussia-dortmund-ausdruckstaenzer-an-der-suedsee-1.1003933

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Ä

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Ä on Fri Sep 24, 2010 1:04 pm

Mertesacker seems to be finished

let's hope it's just a temporary dip though

Hummels HAS to be in the starting 11 for Germany, AHEAD of Badstuber (who is frankly, good AT BEST)

Höwedes is a bit rough around the egdes at the moment

and yes, Dortmund with their KIDS and FLAIR are the German ARSENAL these days

they will inspire other clubs, far more than Bayern, to go for YOUTH

so, kudos to Klopp

as for Kittel

there is a link in the article to an interview with his former youth coach, who argues that the lad is a tad special because of his skills, but maybe even more importantly, because of his CHARACTER

Schürrle commanding in the region of 10 million is really a fantastic indicator of how highly rated our kids are these days within the Bundesliga, that traditionally, paid big for foreign STARS or South American TALENTS

the truth is, IF you want the best these days, you have to go for GERMANS , and for the first time, our sporting directors /managers realise this

PS

van Gaal just sacked ELBER , who acted as a scout in Brazil

the message being, we don't need Brazilians at Bayern anymore when we have Hermann Gerland doing FAR BETTER WORK

Ale



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Stiftung Haeschentest

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Stiftung Haeschentest on Fri Sep 24, 2010 4:41 pm

Allez les rouges wrote:Right, but would you already argue for Merte to be dropped?! Or Hummels to be in pole position to partner him ahead of Badstuber (with Friedrich out)?

It's true, at the WM 2006 I hoped/expected Mertesacker to be among the top defenders in the world come the last WM but what with injuries, slowness etc he became solid rather than exceptional. But we have fewer areas of genuine experience than we have had at times and he remains an important player for me...

I have no preference for any CB pairing yet. Merte doesn't necessarily need to be dropped (although I think he has become quite clumsy, almost a liability for us) but I want more competition.

Mertesacker deserved to be an automatic starter in the past, not least because of the lack of proper options. It also was all too understandable that Jogi didn't want to experiment in the defence ahead of the WC and placed his trust in his proven CB duo. Now that the WC is over and given the many options that emerge, the situation should be reassessed though (not only in the defence, but elsewhere on the pitch as well).

The question should be: Where can we improve?

Our defence is not necessarily a weakness - in fact Merte and Arne were quite solid during the WC - but it's one area where we still have considerable room for improvement IMO as both of them don't contribute enough to our attacking play. As I said above, several teams recently tried to disrupt our attacking flow and build up by isolating Mertesacker from the rest of the team. They give away the ball to him knowing he can do very little harm to them.

Did you read what the chief scout of Serbia (their very own Urs Siegenthaler obviously) had to say about us after the Serbia game:

... Grundprobleme der deutschen Mannschaft

„Deutschland hat zwar wie immer großartige Fußballer, aber in der Defensive individuelle Probleme, besonders beim Spielaufbau. Und die Überraschungsmomente fehlen.“

... die gewinnbringende Taktik der serbischen Mannschaft

„Unser Ziel war, dass der erste Pass möglichst von Mertesacker ausgeht. Zigic sollte immer in der Nähe von Friedrich sein, um zu verhindern, dass Schweinsteiger den Ball auf der linken Seite erhält. Indem wir Schweinsteiger nach rechts zogen, bewirkten wir, dass unsere defensive Aufmerksamkeit auf unsere linke Abwehrseite gelenkt wurde. Damit störten wir den Spielfluss erheblich, weil Schweinsteiger niemanden hatte, mit dem er spielen konnte, und die Deutschen versuchen fast nie, mehrere Linien auf einmal zu überwinden. Und drittens wurde Lahm der Raum, nach vorne zu preschen und Überraschungsmomente zu schaffen, durch unsere Leute, aber auch durch Schweinsteiger verengt.“

[...]


http://www.rp-online.de/sport/fussball/nationalelf/wm/dfb/Unsere-einzige-Sorge-war-Mesut-Oezil_aid_872262.html

In the recent encounters against Belgium and Azerbaijan it was very similar. Both teams had little interest in marking our CBs, they literally run away from them in fact, but only Badstuber was really capable to use effectively the acres of space that was offered to him.

It's just a tremendous benefit to have two CBs who are comfortable with the ball, who can make an intelligent long passes or who can deliver defense-splitting passes. Hummels, Boateng, Badstuber do possess this ability and all three of them would make our build up less predictable. Of course, the potential replacements to Merte and Arne also need to be good solid defenders (wouldn't make sense otherwise Razz), but Hummels IMO certainly is at least on par with Merte and Friedrich in this regard. Badstuber isn't that much behind either and neither is Boateng who was arguably the best CB at the U21 EM.

So IMHO Löw should bench Merte and Arne more often in the upcoming two years and give some other CBs a chance to prove themselves.

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Stiftung Haeschentest

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Stiftung Haeschentest on Fri Sep 24, 2010 4:55 pm

Allez les rouges wrote:You seen this on "the boys" in the SZ Hase? Hype much?

http://www.sueddeutsche.de/sport/bundesliga-borussia-dortmund-ausdruckstaenzer-an-der-suedsee-1.1003933


"Freunde der Südsee: Geht mir nicht auf den Sack, mit Fragen nach neuen Zielsetzungen."

lol!

Too much hype indeed.

Dortmund are playing really well at the moment but Stuttgart, Wolfsburg and Schalke also made it far too easy for us. Unfortunately, I expect them to run out of steam towards the end of the season. Kloppo's game plan (lots of pressing and attack over counter attack) is too physical demanding, especially when you want to compete in three competitions.
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Allez les rouges

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Allez les rouges on Fri Sep 24, 2010 5:28 pm

This is fecking brilliant Häschen, many thanks for this and the link (is there one to the original SZ piece?!). Very much agree. Ale

Yeah the articles in the SZ tend to be increasing but increasingly hype-y, not to say knee-jerk, trying to make an extravagant point for the sack of it. Whether it be over the K-Frage, praising Mainz Lautern Hoffe to the skies for their clever management because they're temporarily top of the league, then the very next match day calling BVB potentially untoppable because of their awesome form.

Entertaining no doubt, but not really very brilliant journalism.
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Stiftung Haeschentest

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Stiftung Haeschentest on Fri Sep 24, 2010 7:24 pm

Allez les rouges wrote:This is fecking brilliant Häschen, many thanks for this and the link (is there one to the original SZ piece?!).

No, apparently not. Looks like the interview was published only in the print version of SZ.

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Isco Benny

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Isco Benny on Fri Sep 24, 2010 10:08 pm

Stiffy, are thee a Dortmund Frauen?
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Stiftung Haeschentest

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Stiftung Haeschentest on Sun Sep 26, 2010 3:37 pm

Holtby reaffirmed his decisions to play for Germany, saying (joking) that he wants to win titles after all. Laugh

Awesome kid.

@Bernd Yep
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Ä

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Ä on Wed Oct 20, 2010 10:07 am

latest Wunderkind is based in Munich

and plays for 1860

Moritz Leitner, 17

you heard it here first

--------------------------

also , keep a close eye on BENDER at Dortmund

everybody's talking about Sahin at Borussia and Khedira at Real, but BENDER could snatch a place in the Mannschaft sooner rather than later

---------------------------

latest rumour: Träsch to replace van Bommel at Bayern

-------------------------

and speaking of DMCs : Polanski has been superb for Mainz

--------------------------

interview with Hrubesch:

http://11freunde.de/bundesligen/133364/uns_faellt_keiner_durchs_raster

he believes the German scouting system is so good now that nobody falls through it undetected

but also points that the key to all those talents popping up mysteriously these days is that clubs give them a proper chance these days, whereas in the past they did not

100% what I said in the past: the difference between Dutch and German talents being that the Dutchies get a proper run-out

----------------------

as for my previous assertion that the Endless Conveyor Belt was now going so fast that ALL the talents could NOT be absorbed by the Bundesliga clubs

for the first time SAMMER now said something similar: he seems to think that the current lot of talents are blessed, because clubs give them a proper chance

HOWEVER, this also means that talents in a few years will find it more difficult to break into senior teams because all the key postions are taken

at Dortmund, for instance, the central defense/midfield positions are taken by


Subotic, Hummels, Sahin, Bender

ALL OF THEM ARE KIDS who may very well continue to play in those positions for YEARS to come

the next Hummels could end up on the bench

reminds me of Malcom Gladwell's theories of the LEADING computer geeks (Jobs, Gates, Balmer...) ALL being born within 3 or so years

Ale
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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Isco Benny on Wed Oct 20, 2010 2:11 pm

Definitely keepiing a keen eye on BENDER . Chortle Ale
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Isco Benny

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Isco Benny on Wed Oct 20, 2010 2:19 pm

Stiftung Haeschentest wrote:Holtby reaffirmed his decisions to play for Germany, saying (joking) that he wants to win titles after all. Laugh

Awesome kid.

@Bernd Yep

Lewis Holtby on Lewis Holtby:

"There was always a chance to talk [to Capello] and to listen about [sic] things." He added that "England and Germany own 50 per cent of my heart and I really love both countries". He said on German television on Sunday that he had decided to commit himself to Germany, having played for the country of his birth at junior levels. It is not anticipated he will change his mind. He added: "I would definitely listen to [Capello]. There is always a chance for a conversation. There is always a chance to talk and to listen about things. I would never say no to a conversation. England and Germany own 50 per cent of my heart and I really love both countries and I pay respect to all of them and especially to a great guy like Capello – he's a legend in the sport of football.

"There are some really good players coming up and English football has a bright future. As I haven't played for the A team for Germany it's all open but I'd like to play for Germany. I would be delighted if the coach would nominate [sic] me for the next games or the future but you never know, in football anything is possible.

"It's not like moving from one club to another, it's playing for a country and you can't really play for two countries, you've got to be proud of yourself and you have to thank the country you started with, and that's the main thing in my head."

Holtby, who added that he'd always supported England "because of my dad", said: "It's the decision of the high [up] guys of the English Football Association. There's a lot of British talent and really good footballers in England, so it would be difficult for me to settle in because I'm half-and-half and especially the rivalry between England and Germany is very high [sic] so it would be a bit strange."

----------------------------

@Otto

So Lewis clearly does not consider himself, nor feels, 100% German. He even supports England over Germany.

Where does this leave you old boy? Should he play for you if he doesn't feel completely German? Whistle
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Ä

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Ä on Wed Oct 20, 2010 2:34 pm

bernd

I was NOT aware of THAT treachery Yikes Doh

my gut instinct now is to "cut him lose" and "set him free"

let the lad play for the country of his father

Ale

even if he is a GERMAN footballer

it's a GIFT from the Vaterland to Engerland

you can also call it development aid

and let's face it

you Englanders need Lewis A LOT MORE than we Teutons do

in other words

Lewis is YOURS, just like Owen Hargreaves, and frankly, you can have Özil, Khedira, Badstuber and the Boatengs as well

fuck

we'll throw in Angela Merkel and if you still need a gay Foreign Secretary, take Westerwelle also

now that we are at it

Franka Potente, Mario Barth, Heiner Geissler, the entire GREEN party and our Octupussy are all yours as well

+

Duisburg and Bochum as cities

Evangelische Kirchentage

Pumpernickel

and the entire German Navy

+

of course, the ZDF Mainzelmännchen

and

Lena

Ale

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Allez les rouges

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Allez les rouges on Wed Oct 20, 2010 4:34 pm

Ä wrote:bernd

I was NOT aware of THAT treachery Yikes Doh

my gut instinct now is to "cut him lose" and "set him free"

let the lad play for the country of his father

Ale

even if he is a GERMAN footballer

it's a GIFT from the Vaterland to Engerland

you can also call it development aid

and let's face it

you Englanders need Lewis A LOT MORE than we Teutons do

in other words

Lewis is YOURS, just like Owen Hargreaves, and frankly, you can have Özil, Khedira, Badstuber and the Boatengs as well

fuck

we'll throw in Angela Merkel and if you still need a gay Foreign Secretary, take Westerwelle also

now that we are at it

Franka Potente, Mario Barth, Heiner Geissler, the entire GREEN party and our Octupussy are all yours as well

+

Duisburg and Bochum as cities

Evangelische Kirchentage

Pumpernickel

and the entire German Navy

+

of course, the ZDF Mainzelmännchen

and

Lena

Ale


Biggrin

Fucking brilliant Ale
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Ä

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Ä on Tue Oct 26, 2010 3:37 pm

Ä wrote:latest Wunderkind is based in Munich

and plays for 1860

Moritz Leitner, 17

you heard it here first


Shocked

only a few days ago, did I mention Leitner as the next Wunderkind to emerge on the global football scene

(note, up to that point , the lad had NOT captured the national media AT ALL)

and then

a few days later

does the national sports press report that Bayern Leverkusen and Dortmund are trying to sign the supertalent

affraid cheers Very Happy

-------------------

as for TONIGHT's Cup game between Bayern and Bremen

watch out for MIELITZ

the goalie, who is still only 20 ro 21, I think

is replacing Wiese

and in his first Bundesliga game last weekend , was UTTERLY BRILLIANT

cheers
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COTR

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by COTR on Tue Oct 26, 2010 3:44 pm

Ä wrote:bernd

I was NOT aware of THAT treachery Yikes Doh

my gut instinct now is to "cut him lose" and "set him free"

let the lad play for the country of his father

Ale

even if he is a GERMAN footballer

it's a GIFT from the Vaterland to Engerland

you can also call it development aid

and let's face it

you Englanders need Lewis A LOT MORE than we Teutons do

in other words

Lewis is YOURS, just like Owen Hargreaves, and frankly, you can have Özil, Khedira, Badstuber and the Boatengs as well

fuck

we'll throw in Angela Merkel and if you still need a gay Foreign Secretary, take Westerwelle also

now that we are at it

Franka Potente, Mario Barth, Heiner Geissler, the entire GREEN party and our Octupussy are all yours as well

+

Duisburg and Bochum as cities

Evangelische Kirchentage

Pumpernickel

and the entire German Navy

+

of course, the ZDF Mainzelmännchen

and

Lena

Ale



Very Happy

Though your Octupussy wouldn't be much use to anybody right now
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Allez les rouges

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Allez les rouges on Tue Oct 26, 2010 4:18 pm

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/oct/26/paul-psychic-octopus-dies-football

Sad

Well we knew he was getting long in the tooth, that's why he was so very wise in the summer Sad
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Six

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Six on Tue Oct 26, 2010 4:23 pm

Got more predictions correct in 2 years than a lifetime of Hansens and Peles.
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Ä

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Ä on Tue Oct 26, 2010 5:02 pm

agree about "Paul, die Krake"

RIP Dove

--------------------

Watzke, the Dortmund boss says, that their current YOUTH policy was really started in 2005, when they had NO money to spend

he claims

and this is HARD to believe

that Borussia Dortmund had only ONE REAL grass-training-pitch

that was used by both the pros and amateurs at the time

Yikes

the other training sessions were held on sand (Asche) surfaces

in 2005 they changed this approach and invested virtually all the money they had still left , in youth initiatives/facilities

and nowadays

the Dortmund kids are 2nd in the league

cheers

-----------

meanwhile, VfB Stuttgart seem to have lost the plot somewhat

the VfB ACADEMY is arguably the BEST in Germany; certainly one of them

yet, most of the talents just move on

often to Hoffenheim

VfB no longer manages to integrate its talents into the senior team

at the moment, 40 VfB youth academy players earn their money in the Bundesliga Yikes

the club that pisses me off more than any other is 1860 München though

they always sell their best talents for a pittance just to keep their club afloat and are then surprised that they never get anywhere

imagine where they would be now , if they had kept

the Bender twins (now at Bayer+Dortmund)

Mlapa: now doing brilliantly at Hoffenheim

Träsch: already a Stuttgart international

Gebhard: also at VfB

...

also doing well: the Hertha kids; and apparently, Babbel is doing his best to use the local Berlin kids once again

Ale

shame on HSV, Cologne and Bremen though

SHAME

Grr

as for Bayern; one of their youth managers said that the Müller, Badstuber, Hummels, Contento... year was the exception

at the moment, MANY senior Bayern players are injured, but the current youth teams provide virtually nobody who could do a Müller

the truth is, van Gaal was LUCKY to stumble upon a Golden Generation Ale

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Allez les rouges

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Allez les rouges on Tue Oct 26, 2010 5:10 pm

I didn't even know Krake could be feminine Embarassed
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chrissicross

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by chrissicross on Tue Oct 26, 2010 5:20 pm

Ä wrote:
as for TONIGHT's Cup game between Bayern and Bremen

watch out for MIELITZ

the goalie, who is still only 20 ro 21, I think

is replacing Wiese

and in his first Bundesliga game last weekend , was UTTERLY BRILLIANT

cheers
Well, actually it was his 3rd Bundesliga game. Razz

But he was brilliant indeed. cheers

---

The Bremen youth academy is quite good btw. We have at least the third best youth academy after Stuttgart and Bayern. After all Bremen, Stuttgart and Bayern are the only German clubs those U23 team is playing in the 3rd Bundesliga. Exclamation

Comparing our youth department with the youth department of the HSV or Cologne is an insult. Evil or Very Mad
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Ä

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by Ä on Tue Oct 26, 2010 5:39 pm

chrissicross wrote:
Ä wrote:
as for TONIGHT's Cup game between Bayern and Bremen

watch out for MIELITZ

the goalie, who is still only 20 ro 21, I think

is replacing Wiese

and in his first Bundesliga game last weekend , was UTTERLY BRILLIANT

cheers
Well, actually it was his 3rd Bundesliga game. Razz

But he was brilliant indeed. cheers

---

The Bremen youth academy is quite good btw. We have at least the third best youth academy after Stuttgart and Bayern. After all Bremen, Stuttgart and Bayern are the only German clubs those U23 team is playing in the 3rd Bundesliga. Exclamation

Comparing our youth department with the youth department of the HSV or Cologne is an insult. Evil or Very Mad

well

the 1860 and Hertha BSC youth teams play in the SECOND Bundesliga

cheers

chrissi, who are those amazing Werder kids you have produced recently ?

maybe Diekmeier, Barfrede, and ?????

ah, sorry, I forgot BOROWSKI

cheers
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chrissicross

Number of posts : 6246
Age : 35
Supports : Werder Bremen
Favourite Player : Per Mertesacker, Thomas Müller
Registration date : 2006-08-10

Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

Post by chrissicross on Tue Oct 26, 2010 5:55 pm

Ä wrote:
well

the 1860 and Hertha BSC youth teams play in the SECOND Bundesliga

cheers
lol!

chrissi, who are those amazing Werder kids you have produced recently ?

maybe Diekmeier, Barfrede, and ?????

ah, sorry, I forgot BOROWSKI

cheers
Simon Rolfes, Aaron Hunt, Christian Schulz, Max Kruse, Martin Harnik... ( Biggrin )

And it's Bargfrede, not Barfrede.

Anyway, you cannot judge how good a youth academy is just based on the amount of well-known Bundesliga players.

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Re: is the endless conveyor belt going too fast

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