Özil has already better stats than xavi-iniesta

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Kroos

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Özil has already better stats than xavi-iniesta

Post by Kroos on Fri Apr 01, 2011 4:04 pm

i am pretty much shocked how worse the stats of xavi/iniesta are in terms of scoring and making assists, though i know they have other strengths (in making the 2nd last pass, keep possession), you could also say fat frank has better stats too than xavi-iniesta, but fatty has not the vision and talent of those three


-------games---goals----------assists
özil----220 31 - 91
xavi----440 48 - 101
iniesat-368 35 - 71

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fcb

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Re: Özil has already better stats than xavi-iniesta

Post by fcb on Fri Apr 01, 2011 5:00 pm

Iniesta:
Barcelona
Spanish League (4): 2004–05, 2005–06, 2008–09, 2009–10
Spanish Cup (1): 2008–09
Spanish Supercup (4): 2005, 2006, 2009, 2010
UEFA Champions League (2): 2005–06, 2008–09
UEFA Super Cup (1): 2009
FIFA Club World Cup (1): 2009
Spain
2010 FIFA World Cup
2008 UEFA European Championship

--------------------------------------------

Xavi:
Barcelona
Spanish League: 5
1998–99, 2004–05, 2005–06, 2008–09, 2009–10
Spanish Cup: 1
2008–09
Spanish Supercup: 4
2005, 2006, 2009, 2010
UEFA Champions League: 2
2005–06, 2008–09
UEFA Super Cup: 1
2009
FIFA Club World Cup: 1
2009

Spain
UEFA European Football Championship: 1
2008
FIFA World Cup: 1
2010

-----------------------------------------------

Ozil:

Werder Bremen
DFB-Pokal: 2009




Stats Ale
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Jaime

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Re: Özil has already better stats than xavi-iniesta

Post by Jaime on Fri Apr 01, 2011 5:14 pm

Iniesta = 26 years old
Xavi = 31 years old
Ozil = 22 years old

Give him some time kas. Xavi had only won one league at that age as well.
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Super Progress

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Re: Özil has already better stats than xavi-iniesta

Post by Super Progress on Fri Apr 01, 2011 5:55 pm

Jaime wrote:Iniesta = 26 years old
Xavi = 31 years old
Ozil = 22 years old

Give him some time kas. Xavi had only won one league at that age as well.
I think he was just having a bit fun with our German friend.
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Jaime

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Re: Özil has already better stats than xavi-iniesta

Post by Jaime on Fri Apr 01, 2011 6:00 pm

Super Laudrup wrote:
Jaime wrote:Iniesta = 26 years old
Xavi = 31 years old
Ozil = 22 years old

Give him some time kas. Xavi had only won one league at that age as well.
I think he was just having a bit fun with our German friend.

And I can't have a bit of fun with old kas?????? Biggrin
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Pras_tama

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Re: Özil has already better stats than xavi-iniesta

Post by Pras_tama on Sat Apr 02, 2011 9:27 am

STOP IT!!!!!!!!
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fcb

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Re: Özil has already better stats than xavi-iniesta

Post by fcb on Sat Apr 02, 2011 9:38 am

Jaime wrote:
Super Laudrup wrote:
Jaime wrote:Iniesta = 26 years old
Xavi = 31 years old
Ozil = 22 years old

Give him some time kas. Xavi had only won one league at that age as well.
I think he was just having a bit fun with our German friend.

And I can't have a bit of fun with old kas?????? Biggrin

Hehe. For the record, I'm an Ozil fan. Fantastic player, will go on to achieve great things. Just not with Madrid Wink
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Kroos

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Re: Özil has already better stats than xavi-iniesta

Post by Kroos on Sat Apr 02, 2011 10:44 am

xavi has not many matches played, what happend to this guy, has he become only good on his 26 birthday or what!!

özil will have better chances to win the ballondor then xavi/iniesta, because hes more spectacular and more goal scoring

though i am the biggest fan of xavi - iniesta, the only midfielders i really like outside german players Very Happy
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Jaime

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Re: Özil has already better stats than xavi-iniesta

Post by Jaime on Sat Apr 02, 2011 4:17 pm

Kroos wrote:xavi has not many matches played, what happend to this guy, has he become only good on his 26 birthday or what!!

özil will have better chances to win the ballondor then xavi/iniesta, because hes more spectacular and more goal scoring

though i am the biggest fan of xavi - iniesta, the only midfielders i really like outside german players Very Happy

I think you are actually quite right about this. The subtle brilliance of Xavi and Iniesta are overlooked at the awards ceremonies. Ozil puts the ball in the net though. Iniesta's goal scoring is better these days though I always thought that was an aspect of his game that should be a lot better. He always strikes me as a player that scores important goals but does not score consistently enough.
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Re: Özil has already better stats than xavi-iniesta

Post by S4P on Sun Apr 03, 2011 11:35 am

While Xavi might possibly be the better of the two, Iniesta, I would argue, is the better 'big match' player of the two (at least from the few 'big matches' I've seen of Barcelona and Spain).
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fcb

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Re: Özil has already better stats than xavi-iniesta

Post by fcb on Sun Apr 03, 2011 11:53 am

What makes you say that?
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Deluded F*ck™

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Re: Özil has already better stats than xavi-iniesta

Post by Deluded F*ck™ on Sun Apr 03, 2011 1:17 pm

I tend to agree with Swarpy , MOTM in the CL Final 2009, World Cup Final, equaliser at stamford Bridge in the 2009 CL semi, and I thought Barca missed him big time against Inter last year.

Xavi is one of the greatest CM's of all time though.
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fcb

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Re: Özil has already better stats than xavi-iniesta

Post by fcb on Sun Apr 03, 2011 2:47 pm

Yes, but what I'd like to know is, how do you determine that Iniesta is a better big match player? I reckon it's the "why do attacking players, especially strikers, usually always win the Balon d'Or" situation.

Iniesta's game is easier to notice than Xavi - he dribbles more, gets closer to goal, and tends to score more often. Xavi does a passing job quietly in midfield and you don't always notice it, unless he gets assists, like in the 0-2 win away to Madrid last season.

I've always said - take a game that Spain/Barça won comfortably, take out Xavi from the team keeping all other things equal, and play the game again. Then spot the difference...maybe not in the result, but definitely in the style and performance.
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S4P

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Re: Özil has already better stats than xavi-iniesta

Post by S4P on Sun Apr 03, 2011 2:51 pm

fcb wrote:What makes you say that?

The reasons TS just wrote - two extremely important goals - the incredible 93rd minute strike at Stamford Bridge (although I don't think he played very well in that match, but still stepped up right at the end), the World Cup final goal, being the best player on the pitch (in my opinion) in both the 2009 CL final and the 2010 World Cup final.

Xavi is an exceptional player, and probably the more consistent of the two (at least from the matches I've seen), but Iniesta appears to play better in the very big matches. His absence from your semi-final 2nd leg against Inter last season is - as TS implied - crucially underrated (a match where Xavi's game was largely stifled).
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Cesc Soler

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Re: Özil has already better stats than xavi-iniesta

Post by Cesc Soler on Sun Apr 03, 2011 3:13 pm

Sid Lowe on Ozil in today's 'guardian.co.uk : The Observer'


Real Madrid find 'Nemo' to their liking as Mesut Ozil settles in well

Germany midfielder has taken to La Liga like a fish to water and won admirers among the fans, his team-mates and the media



He has been likened to a tortoise, a hare, an owl, a clownfish and a chameleon, and it all started in a monkey's cage. It could be one of Aesop's fables. Instead, it is Ozil's. The story of the Turk who represents a new Germany and a new Real Madrid, yet also represents something older, something disappearing. Mesut Ozil: future and past in one, a street footballer whose director general, Jorge Valdano, believes "will define the next decade" and whose team-mate Xabi Alonso describes as "the kind of player you don't find these days". The playmaker who joined Madrid for €15m.

That figure, about Ł13.2m, was a bargain, possibly last summer's best business. To put that into context: it is less than a third of what Chelsea paid for Fernando Torres, less than half the amount Aston Villa paid for James Milner, less than a quarter of the €65m Kaká cost Madrid the previous summer – and no one would swap now. All for one of the World Cup's finest performers; who, eight months on, stakes a claim to be La Liga's outstanding player. Certainly beyond Cristiano Ronaldo and Lionel Messi. He is so good they are likening him to Zinedine Zidane.

Speaking in German – his Spanish still limited to a pre-prepared stuttering, if crowd-pleasing, "I want to win titles with Real Madrid" – Ozil says: "I'm not Zidane yet." He could hardly say otherwise. In Madrid, the comparison is powerful and Ozil is still in his first year at a new club and in a new country. "Zidane was world-class," he says, "I haven't done anything yet. I'm here to develop, I still have so much to prove."

Except that is partly the point. Even when Ozil's talent has been seen only in flashes, they have been flashes that win over a Spanish crowd – more enamoured with artistry than elsewhere. "He's the kind of player who goes down well," Valdano says, "even opponents like watching him." Besides, he has done more than most anticipated. It is the relative consistency that has surprised, the speed of adaptation. Hardly surprising that a partisan press is now getting so excited.

A couple of weeks ago, Marca splashed its cover with cartoons of every Madrid player, alongside their supposed nicknames. In the middle was Ozil – footballer turned fish, orange stripes and goggle-eyes. The headline said it all: Real Madrid were "Nemo's Gang". The following day, he was portrayed gazing at the Balon d'Or, the trophy that "awaits him".

It was a significant break from the editorial line: someone other than Ronaldo centre stage, the leader. It was also an exaggeration, but there was something in it – and not just because Ronaldo was missing when Ozil, all graceful movement and clever passing, masterminded the destruction of Racing Santander, 3-1, in La Liga last month.

"Ozil," says Alvaro Arbeloa, "is a scandalously good player. I wouldn't say the media jumped on board too quickly. In fact, you've taken your time to realise just how good he is. Then again, we see him in training every day, you only see him once a week. We knew he was special straight away. Sometimes it can seem like Ronaldo is the only player here, but there are other good players too – and Ozil is bueno, bueno."

Ozil always has been. The man a computer game called the owl, a commentator claimed had chameleon eyes – bulging but all-seeing – and a German philosopher described as owning a turtle's face, began playing in Gelsenkirchen in the Ruhr valley, where he was born in 1988, the son of Turkish immigrants. The mines have closed down now, but the tower still looms over Bismark; a largely Turkish neighbourhood, with a small, rough gravel football pitch enclosed by hostile wire fences, where the ball never went out and games never ended. A pitch they called the Affenkäfig: the monkey cage.

Ralf Maraun, one of Ozil's first youth coaches, says he is the "classic street player – timid and small, but incredibly talented". If he was Argentinian you'd call him potrero, learning close control and cunning as a necessity. Anything but regimented, except that he was regimented, too: he joined DJK Westphalia 04 at seven. As Ozil has put it: "My technique and feel for the ball is the Turkish side of my game; the discipline and attitude all come from Germany." And when it came to the contested decision over international football, Ozil responded: "I was made as a footballer here."

Germany was fine: Ozil was the Bundesliga's outstanding performer last year, providing 17 assists. Spain was a step again. For a start, he spoke no Spanish. On the opening day, he was left out of the Real Madrid side, José Mourinho admitting he could not converse with the playmaker. Between them, his staff spoke a handful of languages, but German was not one of them. Meanwhile, Ozil's English is limited; even his German is not perfect – his career began with his father shouting instructions in Turkish.

Language was not the only problem. Perhaps there should have been more faith: why should he not adapt to Spain as his family adapted to Germany?

It is not as if he had made it this far without resolve. But Ozil, far from outgoing – a man who says his favourite film is The Karate Kid and is a quiet, practising Muslim – was dismissed. Even those enamoured by his football in Germany thought he would struggle. He is only a kid – he turns 23 next season – and the pressure would be huge. The journey from the monkey cage to the bear pit was a long one.

They were not alone. The Spanish league's style suits him, but success was not guaranteed. Certainly not success like this. Real Madrid signed Ozil, impressed by the World Cup and attracted by the price tag – another in a long line of media-puntas, another must-have accessory. Although his age was further attraction, the truth is, they did not necessarily expect to talk about him as the artificer of the future. Now, they do.

The main reason Ozil was cheap and available was his refusal to renew his contract with Werder Bremen – but it was also because of concerns. Pay €15m for Ozil? It looks so obvious now; it was less obvious then. Arsenal watched him and liked him; Barcelona, too. Barça were his club, Messi his hero, but doubts lingered and priorities lay elsewhere. In Madrid, they were quick and Mourinho encouraged the pursuit. They took advantage of the question marks that remained about a player whose brilliance was often seen in passing.

There is certainly brilliance in his passing. Madrid are a side built to counterattack and who, as the season has progressed, have found doing so harder. Teams are waiting for them now, sitting deep and closing up. That has required a different skill – Ozil's skill. In a team of athletes, it is Ozil, alongside Alonso, who is the aesthete, providing the subtlety and the vision, giving flow to the physicality, looking for the angled pass, slipped silently beyond a sea of legs. Coming in from either side, moving freely, the kind of footballer who does not just play well, but makes others play better, too.

"He understands the game, sees things, combines and thrives between the lines, unlocking teams," Alonso says. Valdano highlights his "collective play", the ability to "create football". "Ozil," Mourinho says, "is unique. There is no copy of him – not even a bad copy."

That is why the Portuguese coach has protected and nurtured him carefully, even as he has used him. Ronaldo's injury means Ozil is now the only Real Madrid player to have appeared in every league game this season, yet he has lasted 90 minutes only five times. It has brought about a perceptible shift in style – bringing Ozil to the fore. With every match, he appears to take on greater significance. Under Mourinho, his confidence has grown. Although still slight, so have his muscles.

"Ozil has evolved," Mourinho continues. "Before, there were details, glimpses of his class, but he mixed those with quieter moments. Now he stands out for his dynamism and the continuity in his game." The cumulative effect of his contributions, not always consistent, allowed him to emerge – if not in performances, certainly into the collective consciousness. It is not just about playing well, it is about people noticing.

A relatively discreet if steady start had the happy consequence of releasing him from the need to live up to his own early hype. Sometimes a debut hat-trick is the worse thing that can happen here. Now what appeared slow looks quick. It has still been only eight months, after all.

Silently, almost by stealth, his statistics started to stand out. Now they are inescapable: nine goals in all competitions and 11 league assists, plus three in Europe and one in the Spanish Cup, speak greater volumes than he does. Only Messi has provided more assists in La Liga.

Quick-footed, blessed with a soft touch, Ozil moves with speed and smoothness, two-footed and agile. He has been involved in 25 of Madrid's 101 goals. In total, he has created 100 goalscoring opportunities, more than anyone else in Spain. "Ozil is playing absolutely fantastic football," Mourinho says. "Real Madrid have a great player – and for a long, long time."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2011/apr/03/mesut-ozil-real-madrid-football

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Hlebagone

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Re: Özil has already better stats than xavi-iniesta

Post by Hlebagone on Sun Apr 03, 2011 3:24 pm

"All for one of the World Cup's finest performers; who, eight months on, stakes a claim to be La Liga's outstanding player. Certainly beyond Cristiano Ronaldo and Lionel Messi. He is so good they are likening him to Zinedine Zidane."

I do like Sid Lowe, his enthusiasm for the Spanish game comes across, and he does know how stuff. Think he gets carried away (above), and I'm not convinced if his writing style is actually any good.

Sheffield gunner

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Re: Özil has already better stats than xavi-iniesta

Post by Sheffield gunner on Sun Apr 03, 2011 6:19 pm

That was what I thought. He does tend to resort to hyperbole and exaggeration. I do enjoy his writing, and I would expect and hope that he can write well considering his academic background. I wouldn't mind seeing a bit more tactical analysis from him though, as most of his articles tend to eulogise Barca/Real Madrid or take quite a light-hearted approach to the rest of La Liga.

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