Messi

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ERIK LAMELA

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Re: Messi

Post by ERIK LAMELA on Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:38 pm

The REAL question is: is Messi now the greatest Gaucho of all time? When will he be deemed to have surpassed Maradona?
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Fey

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Re: Messi

Post by Fey on Fri Dec 14, 2012 7:55 pm

I think never. Besides when you say Messi you think Barca. When you think Maradonna you think Argentina. And this of course.

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khan55

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Re: Messi

Post by khan55 on Wed Dec 19, 2012 6:56 am

Messi is good footballer in all over the world soccer history.This player is very famous in all over the world and many fans in this player.This year Messi is very costly player and many record break goal in this year.I also like this player and his skills of football game.
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Antarion

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Re: Messi

Post by Antarion on Wed Dec 19, 2012 8:31 am

In other news, water is wet
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Kimbo

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Re: Messi

Post by Kimbo on Wed Dec 19, 2012 2:51 pm

I've decided he is the GOAT, fuck these oldies, people insisting he needs to win a world cup like Pele and Maradona. International football was weak back then, the Africans were shit, the Asians were shitter, even teams like Turkey were bitch meat.
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Chris 23*

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Re: Messi

Post by Chris 23* on Wed Dec 19, 2012 2:55 pm

Antarion wrote:In other news, water is wet

Laughing
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EMP

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Re: Messi

Post by EMP on Wed Dec 19, 2012 3:22 pm

Kimbo wrote:I've decided he is the GOAT, fuck these oldies, people insisting he needs to win a world cup like Pele and Maradona. International football was weak back then, the Africans were shit, the Asians were shitter, even teams like Turkey were bitch meat.

Not in Maradona's day.
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Kimbo

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Re: Messi

Post by Kimbo on Wed Dec 19, 2012 4:07 pm

EMP wrote:
Kimbo wrote:I've decided he is the GOAT, fuck these oldies, people insisting he needs to win a world cup like Pele and Maradona. International football was weak back then, the Africans were shit, the Asians were shitter, even teams like Turkey were bitch meat.

Not in Maradona's day.

Question Yes, in Maradona's day.

On Turkey, I just looked at UEFA's qualifying groups for the 86 world cup, they were bottom of their group with just 1 draw, they scored 2 and let in 24.
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EMP

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Re: Messi

Post by EMP on Wed Dec 19, 2012 4:28 pm

Kimbo wrote:
EMP wrote:
Kimbo wrote:I've decided he is the GOAT, fuck these oldies, people insisting he needs to win a world cup like Pele and Maradona. International football was weak back then, the Africans were shit, the Asians were shitter, even teams like Turkey were bitch meat.

Not in Maradona's day.

Question Yes, in Maradona's day.

On Turkey, I just looked at UEFA's qualifying groups for the 86 world cup, they were bottom of their group with just 1 draw, they scored 2 and let in 24.

Morocco in 1986 were not awful and Zaki Badou (their goalkeeper) was one of the top players at least in his position in the tournament. Cameroon in 1990 certainly were not shit either - naive yes, but certainly not shit. Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Cameroon surprise Argentina in that tournament on their way to Africa's first quarter-final appearance. Both were in Maradona's time.


Last edited by EMP on Wed Dec 19, 2012 5:39 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Luis

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Re: Messi

Post by Luis on Wed Dec 19, 2012 4:29 pm

khan55 wrote:Messi is good footballer in all over the world soccer history.This player is very famous in all over the world and many fans in this player.This year Messi is very costly player and many record break goal in this year.I also like this player and his skills of football game.

Interesting. Sounds like this Messi could be some talent in the future <Ale>
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TITO

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Re: Messi

Post by TITO on Wed Dec 19, 2012 4:31 pm

EMP wrote:
Kimbo wrote:
EMP wrote:
Kimbo wrote:I've decided he is the GOAT, fuck these oldies, people insisting he needs to win a world cup like Pele and Maradona. International football was weak back then, the Africans were shit, the Asians were shitter, even teams like Turkey were bitch meat.

Not in Maradona's day.

Question Yes, in Maradona's day.

On Turkey, I just looked at UEFA's qualifying groups for the 86 world cup, they were bottom of their group with just 1 draw, they scored 2 and let in 24.

Morocco in 1986 were not awful and Cameroon in 1990 certainly were not. Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Cameroon surprise Argentina in that tournament on their way to Africa'as first quarter-final appearance. Both were in Maradona's time.

So what Maradona did in 1990 that is worth talking about it???? Couple of great moments, and that should sum up a great tournament??
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Kimbo

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Re: Messi

Post by Kimbo on Wed Dec 19, 2012 4:33 pm

EMP wrote:
Kimbo wrote:
EMP wrote:
Kimbo wrote:I've decided he is the GOAT, fuck these oldies, people insisting he needs to win a world cup like Pele and Maradona. International football was weak back then, the Africans were shit, the Asians were shitter, even teams like Turkey were bitch meat.

Not in Maradona's day.

Question Yes, in Maradona's day.

On Turkey, I just looked at UEFA's qualifying groups for the 86 world cup, they were bottom of their group with just 1 draw, they scored 2 and let in 24.

Morocco in 1986 were not awful and Cameroon in 1990 certainly were not. Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Cameroon surprise Argentina in that tournament on their way to Africa'as first quarter-final appearance. Both were in Maradona's time.

You really think African countries were as strong back then???
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EMP

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Re: Messi

Post by EMP on Wed Dec 19, 2012 5:41 pm

Kimbo wrote:
EMP wrote:
Kimbo wrote:
EMP wrote:
Kimbo wrote:I've decided he is the GOAT, fuck these oldies, people insisting he needs to win a world cup like Pele and Maradona. International football was weak back then, the Africans were shit, the Asians were shitter, even teams like Turkey were bitch meat.

Not in Maradona's day.

Question Yes, in Maradona's day.

On Turkey, I just looked at UEFA's qualifying groups for the 86 world cup, they were bottom of their group with just 1 draw, they scored 2 and let in 24.

Morocco in 1986 were not awful and Cameroon in 1990 certainly were not. Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Cameroon surprise Argentina in that tournament on their way to Africa'as first quarter-final appearance. Both were in Maradona's time.

You really think African countries were as strong back then???

Of course not, but everyone has got stronger. I'm saying that African countries were not shit on a stick Zaire 1974 excepted.
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EMP

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Re: Messi

Post by EMP on Wed Dec 19, 2012 5:43 pm

TITO wrote:
EMP wrote:
Kimbo wrote:
EMP wrote:
Kimbo wrote:I've decided he is the GOAT, fuck these oldies, people insisting he needs to win a world cup like Pele and Maradona. International football was weak back then, the Africans were shit, the Asians were shitter, even teams like Turkey were bitch meat.

Not in Maradona's day.

Question Yes, in Maradona's day.

On Turkey, I just looked at UEFA's qualifying groups for the 86 world cup, they were bottom of their group with just 1 draw, they scored 2 and let in 24.

Morocco in 1986 were not awful and Cameroon in 1990 certainly were not. Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Cameroon surprise Argentina in that tournament on their way to Africa'as first quarter-final appearance. Both were in Maradona's time.

So what Maradona did in 1990 that is worth talking about it???? Couple of great moments, and that should sum up a great tournament??

No but Kimbo mentioned Maradona. 1990 was in Maradona's era. They reached the final in his era and African countries, especially Cameroon were not shit in that tournament, which was my point of contention with Kimbo's post.
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TITO

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Re: Messi

Post by TITO on Wed Dec 19, 2012 6:07 pm

Yes, Cameroon were not shit, they did played well, but i do remember how Argentina reached that final. Even Greece 2004 was better.
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Kimbo

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Re: Messi

Post by Kimbo on Wed Dec 19, 2012 6:14 pm

Ok, maybe shit was extreme. tongue I have a point though, people point at Maradona "winning the world cup single handed", I think it is unfair to expect Messi to do the same, they're effectively saying "Messi can never surpass Maradona", because it's not going to happen in this day and age.
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EMP

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Re: Messi

Post by EMP on Wed Dec 19, 2012 6:16 pm

TITO wrote:Yes, Cameroon were not shit, they did played well, but i do remember how Argentina reached that final. Even Greece 2004 was better.

Tito, I'm not defending Argentina in 1990. They played horrible football. Greece was different. They deserve credit. They had a plan, played to it and won the tournament the hard way, beating Portugal twice. That wasn't luck. That was an excellent exhibition of playing to their strengths. They deserved to win that tournament and did.

Meanwhile, my point remains. Africa was not shit in Maradona's career, as Kimbo claimed.
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EMP

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Re: Messi

Post by EMP on Wed Dec 19, 2012 6:22 pm

Kimbo wrote:Ok, maybe shit was extreme. tongue I have a point though, people point at Maradona "winning the world cup single handed", I think it is unfair to expect Messi to do the same, they're effectively saying "Messi can never surpass Maradona", because it's not going to happen in this day and age.

Fair enough, but I think the point with Maradona was that he carried an ordinary team on his back and made them World Champions. It would be enough for Messi to win with Argentina - you can't help the quality around you. Had the Netherlands won in 1974 there would still have been a wankfest over Cruyff, but the rest of that Dutch team was hardly full of dross was it?
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Kimbo

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Re: Messi

Post by Kimbo on Wed Dec 19, 2012 6:45 pm

EMP wrote:
Kimbo wrote:Ok, maybe shit was extreme. tongue I have a point though, people point at Maradona "winning the world cup single handed", I think it is unfair to expect Messi to do the same, they're effectively saying "Messi can never surpass Maradona", because it's not going to happen in this day and age.

Fair enough, but I think the point with Maradona was that he carried an ordinary team on his back and made them World Champions. It would be enough for Messi to win with Argentina - you can't help the quality around you. Had the Netherlands won in 1974 there would still have been a wankfest over Cruyff, but the rest of that Dutch team was hardly full of dross was it?

But then the champions league is of a higher quality than the world cup anyway, in my eyes Messi has already done it at the highest level more than once. It seems off to me that he has to do it in an inferior tournament to prove himself.
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Kroos

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Re: Messi

Post by Kroos on Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:06 pm

Kimbo wrote:
EMP wrote:
Kimbo wrote:Ok, maybe shit was extreme. tongue I have a point though, people point at Maradona "winning the world cup single handed", I think it is unfair to expect Messi to do the same, they're effectively saying "Messi can never surpass Maradona", because it's not going to happen in this day and age.

Fair enough, but I think the point with Maradona was that he carried an ordinary team on his back and made them World Champions. It would be enough for Messi to win with Argentina - you can't help the quality around you. Had the Netherlands won in 1974 there would still have been a wankfest over Cruyff, but the rest of that Dutch team was hardly full of dross was it?

But then the champions league is of a higher quality than the world cup anyway, in my eyes Messi has already done it at the highest level more than once. It seems off to me that he has to do it in an inferior tournament to prove himself.

i don`t think that the champions league is a higher quality, not in psychological terms, and the top teams can surely beat the likes of real madrid, bayern, united

you are facking out and have to wait for another 4 years when you make a mistake, so the level of tension, concentration and probably fear to lose is unmachted, and only players who are strong in the head will deliver

i think messi is good, and very consistent, but he plays with team mates who won 2 EC and 1 WC, so maybe he aint that special at all
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EMP

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Re: Messi

Post by EMP on Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:13 pm

Kimbo wrote:
EMP wrote:
Kimbo wrote:Ok, maybe shit was extreme. tongue I have a point though, people point at Maradona "winning the world cup single handed", I think it is unfair to expect Messi to do the same, they're effectively saying "Messi can never surpass Maradona", because it's not going to happen in this day and age.

Fair enough, but I think the point with Maradona was that he carried an ordinary team on his back and made them World Champions. It would be enough for Messi to win with Argentina - you can't help the quality around you. Had the Netherlands won in 1974 there would still have been a wankfest over Cruyff, but the rest of that Dutch team was hardly full of dross was it?

But then the champions league is of a higher quality than the world cup anyway, in my eyes Messi has already done it at the highest level more than once. It seems off to me that he has to do it in an inferior tournament to prove himself.

I disagree. In the Champion's League he is surrounded by a higher quality of player than at international level and he is up against a stiffer test in Spain at international level than he is at club level. Not his fault, but I think it is natural to test the greatest against the best and Spain at international level offer that test in a way that he doesn't get at Barcelona. I think the bigger question mark against him is the failure at regional level with Argentina. Surely even a mediocre Messi-led Argentina should have some South American championships to his name. After all there's no Spain, Germany or Italy to stand in their way there.

stinger

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Re: Messi

Post by stinger on Thu Dec 20, 2012 1:01 pm

Kroos wrote:
Kimbo wrote:
EMP wrote:
Kimbo wrote:Ok, maybe shit was extreme. tongue I have a point though, people point at Maradona "winning the world cup single handed", I think it is unfair to expect Messi to do the same, they're effectively saying "Messi can never surpass Maradona", because it's not going to happen in this day and age.

Fair enough, but I think the point with Maradona was that he carried an ordinary team on his back and made them World Champions. It would be enough for Messi to win with Argentina - you can't help the quality around you. Had the Netherlands won in 1974 there would still have been a wankfest over Cruyff, but the rest of that Dutch team was hardly full of dross was it?

But then the champions league is of a higher quality than the world cup anyway, in my eyes Messi has already done it at the highest level more than once. It seems off to me that he has to do it in an inferior tournament to prove himself.

i don`t think that the champions league is a higher quality, not in psychological terms, and the top teams can surely beat the likes of real madrid, bayern, united

you are facking out and have to wait for another 4 years when you make a mistake, so the level of tension, concentration and probably fear to lose is unmachted, and only players who are strong in the head will deliver

i think messi is good, and very consistent, but he plays with team mates who won 2 EC and 1 WC, so maybe he aint that special at all
Totally disagree. Clubs have much more time for practice than NTs, which gives them a huge advantage. Plus for example, club having two quality left backs and no quality right back can do something about it, National Teams usually can't.
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Kimbo

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Re: Messi

Post by Kimbo on Thu Dec 20, 2012 1:31 pm

Lets face it, International football is DOMINATED and HUMILIATED by a shit Barcelona. tongue I agree that there is more pressure at the world cup, but that is all, I think there is a noticeable difference in the quality of football.
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Kroos

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Re: Messi

Post by Kroos on Thu Dec 20, 2012 1:53 pm

stinger wrote:
Kroos wrote:
Kimbo wrote:
EMP wrote:
Kimbo wrote:Ok, maybe shit was extreme. tongue I have a point though, people point at Maradona "winning the world cup single handed", I think it is unfair to expect Messi to do the same, they're effectively saying "Messi can never surpass Maradona", because it's not going to happen in this day and age.

Fair enough, but I think the point with Maradona was that he carried an ordinary team on his back and made them World Champions. It would be enough for Messi to win with Argentina - you can't help the quality around you. Had the Netherlands won in 1974 there would still have been a wankfest over Cruyff, but the rest of that Dutch team was hardly full of dross was it?

But then the champions league is of a higher quality than the world cup anyway, in my eyes Messi has already done it at the highest level more than once. It seems off to me that he has to do it in an inferior tournament to prove himself.

i don`t think that the champions league is a higher quality, not in psychological terms, and the top teams can surely beat the likes of real madrid, bayern, united

you are facking out and have to wait for another 4 years when you make a mistake, so the level of tension, concentration and probably fear to lose is unmachted, and only players who are strong in the head will deliver

i think messi is good, and very consistent, but he plays with team mates who won 2 EC and 1 WC, so maybe he aint that special at all
Totally disagree. Clubs have much more time for practice than NTs, which gives them a huge advantage. Plus for example, club having two quality left backs and no quality right back can do something about it, National Teams usually can't.

agree about the practice stuff, this gives spain a huge edge

but look at the wc 2010, holland, germany and spain had fantastic teams, juve is right now italy, the quality is there at the top nations

sure with at least one weak spot, but how many teams in the cl have no weak points!? maybe bayern and barca, real has 2 leftbacks and one shit right back, also there right midfield is limited

bvb has schmelzer, and no depth
united no midfield
juve no striker
chelsea no striker, no world class CM






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EMP

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Re: Messi

Post by EMP on Wed Dec 26, 2012 2:57 pm

Kimbo wrote:Lets face it, International football is DOMINATED and HUMILIATED by a shit Barcelona. tongue I agree that there is more pressure at the world cup, but that is all, I think there is a noticeable difference in the quality of football.

Er, Spain.

Meanwhile, Chitalu deserves respect. http://www.goal.com/en-sg/news/3955/africa/2012/12/13/3597899/bwalya-it-is-a-fact-chitalu-scored-107-goals-in-1972

No reason to believe that Chitalu could not have made it in Europe - Bwalya did. Kalusha also ripped Italy a new one in 1988 Olympics, scoring a hat-trick. Bwalya's hero was Chitalu.
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Kimbo

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Re: Messi

Post by Kimbo on Wed Dec 26, 2012 3:04 pm

EMP wrote:
Kimbo wrote:Lets face it, International football is DOMINATED and HUMILIATED by a shit Barcelona. tongue I agree that there is more pressure at the world cup, but that is all, I think there is a noticeable difference in the quality of football.

Er, Spain.

Meanwhile, Chitalu deserves respect. http://www.goal.com/en-sg/news/3955/africa/2012/12/13/3597899/bwalya-it-is-a-fact-chitalu-scored-107-goals-in-1972

No reason to believe that Chitalu could not have made it in Europe - Bwalya did. Kalusha also ripped Italy a new one in 1988 Olympics, scoring a hat-trick. Bwalya's hero was Chitalu.

What about Spain? They're Barcelona minus the creativity.
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EMP

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Re: Messi

Post by EMP on Wed Dec 26, 2012 3:24 pm

Kimbo wrote:
EMP wrote:
Kimbo wrote:Lets face it, International football is DOMINATED and HUMILIATED by a shit Barcelona. tongue I agree that there is more pressure at the world cup, but that is all, I think there is a noticeable difference in the quality of football.

Er, Spain.

Meanwhile, Chitalu deserves respect. http://www.goal.com/en-sg/news/3955/africa/2012/12/13/3597899/bwalya-it-is-a-fact-chitalu-scored-107-goals-in-1972

No reason to believe that Chitalu could not have made it in Europe - Bwalya did. Kalusha also ripped Italy a new one in 1988 Olympics, scoring a hat-trick. Bwalya's hero was Chitalu.

What about Spain? They're Barcelona minus the creativity.

I'd say they have a fair bit of creativity too. They have won three top quality competitions consecutively - something no other international team has achieved. The World Cup was hardly their fault - de Jong should have been arrested, never mind a red card. Their football has been fluent and creative too and it has achieved a spirit that few thought possible between Barca and Real Madrid players. Bar Messi, who Spain proved they don't need, who and what are they missing?

Sheffield gunner

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Re: Messi

Post by Sheffield gunner on Mon Jan 07, 2013 7:06 pm

Messi wins a highly unexpected fourth Ballon d'Or in a row, and celebrates by wearing an hilarious polka dot suit.

Messi: 41.6%

Ronaldo: 23.7%

Iniesta: 10.9%
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Luis

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Re: Messi

Post by Luis on Mon Jan 07, 2013 7:15 pm

Never in doubt. Ronaldo will have to out score him and win the European Cup to win one of these.
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messiah

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Re: Messi

Post by messiah on Mon Jan 07, 2013 7:30 pm

Fuck this iniesta is better

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