EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

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Pierre Littbarski

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by Pierre Littbarski on Wed Jun 20, 2012 12:56 pm

I think if you look at 1st half of Milan 3-3 Liverpool and the whole Barca 3-1 United at Wembley you see why I think that, for all the lovers of 4-3-3/4-5-1, a diamond or a team like Italy with a very narrow midfield is the best when you have the right players.

.........Pirlo.........

Gattuso.........Seedorf

..........Kaka.........

...with Cafu on the overlap



.........Busquets..........

....Xavi.........Iniesta...

...........Messi...........

...with Dani Alves on the overlap



Some people look at that system and think you will beat it just by playing balls out to fast wingers but as United discovered you get so overwhelmed in midfield that you either can't get decent supply to them or they end up firefighting in the middle to try and keep you in the game - in which case you would rather have had 2 extra CM's to start with.


Whilst I think it is the best system to play, if you have the players (in these instances some of the best midfielders in recent footballing history and perhaps 2 of the best RB's to ever have played the game) not many teams at club level let alone national will be able to boast all these players.

So...

.......T.Silva........

Gattuso.......Flamini..

.......Seedorf.........


...with Abate on the overlap is not quite the same so its a system for systems sake and u can get done even by injury ravaged Spurs.


The current Italian midifield is good but not scary good - I will expect them to dominate possession to a degree but we will really be able to get at their fullbacks who will be exposed and maybe get 2 v 1's.

I think Roy will undoubtedly go with Rooney which makes sense because he will drop into midfield to stop us getting too overrun and can maybe disrupt Pirlo but I quite like the idea of Carroll and Welbeck against this Italian defence.

Also do you go with Milner who will help defend against Balzaretti or with Walcott who can expose him ?

Whilst Welbeck and Carroll are the sort who can trouble their CB's I think exactly the same is true of Cassano - he will give Terry and Lescott a much greater problem than a big striker playing right up against them may do.

Like Milan v Spurs - I think Italy's way of playing football is the best there is and better than ours but i don't quite think they have good enough players to really pull it off.

I think we will nick this one - trying to disrupt Pirlo should be page 1 of playing v Italy but the others to fear sre Cassano with his fantastic movement and Marchisio who is due a screamer at some point pale

Balotelli - who knows ?

I think England v Balotelli is a dream come true for our media Smile
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BoBo Vieri 32

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by BoBo Vieri 32 on Wed Jun 20, 2012 1:06 pm

Good analysis, but my feeling is that we will go back to the 3-5-2 for this game, because Chiellini is out and we didn't look too good against Ireland with the diamond midfield.

3-5-2 against 4-4-2 is interesting. England still might get the 2 on 1 situation down the wings and push the Italys wingbacks into a 5-3-2 formation. However Italy get the 3 in midfield (and one of these is Pirlo) and a spare man at the back.
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Pirlo

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by Pirlo on Wed Jun 20, 2012 1:33 pm

BoBo Vieri 32 wrote:Good analysis, but my feeling is that we will go back to the 3-5-2 for this game, because Chiellini is out and we didn't look too good against Ireland with the diamond midfield.

3-5-2 against 4-4-2 is interesting. England still might get the 2 on 1 situation down the wings and push the Italys wingbacks into a 5-3-2 formation. However Italy get the 3 in midfield (and one of these is Pirlo) and a spare man at the back.

I'm more concerned with the lack of goals and creativity in open play from us, playing with wingers is completely futile if all they do is put crosses in - there's no-one in the box usually and Cassano/Balotelli are not really the types to make vertical depth or attack them. If there job is to get into the box, then that leaves us very vulnerable on the counter, and 3 man defence or not, Italians aren't so hot these days in dealing with those situations, and the midfield is going to be easily bypassed ,

So possession and a certain tightness between different lines is key, as well as minimising the space behind the wing-backs, whoever plays i think wide areas and how we compress the space between the centre of defence and midfield is going to be vital, i'd be fine with posession and an amount of proactive football IF we had goalscorers, we're essentially playing a frontline of no.10's and second strikers whoever plays,
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Puro

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by Puro on Wed Jun 20, 2012 2:17 pm

I wonder if Prandelli will go to the 4-3-2-1 to funnel everything English to the middle of the pitch. He's the only Italiano I've seen to make clubs based in England look really bad. Remember his Fiorentina and my man Vargas beating the shite out of our beloved Liverpool? Man, was that a can of whoop ass or what! Shocked

There's a few Liverpool players still playing for England who remember that utter humiliation.

A & K

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by A & K on Wed Jun 20, 2012 2:41 pm

Portugal-Deutschland Espania- Italia

I think Portgual and Germany should win, dunno what the outcome will be between England and Italy, I would give Italy 52% and England 48%.

As for France -Spain, should of course win this game, but in football you never know.

Spain has never won against us in an official game (5 losses, 1 draw), kind of normal since they've started been very good since 2008...
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Puro

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by Puro on Wed Jun 20, 2012 2:50 pm

Alive and Kicking wrote:Portugal-Deutschland Espania- Italia

I think Portgual and Germany should win, dunno what the outcome will be between England and Italy, I would give Italy 52% and England 48%.

As for France -Spain, should of course win this game, but in football you never know.

Spain has never won against us in an official game (5 losses, 1 draw), kind of normal since they've started been very good since 2008...

I'm really looking forward to the España-France match up. Blanc obviously (to me personally) wanted them. What's he got for them?
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Fade out

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by Fade out on Wed Jun 20, 2012 2:51 pm

Enough excuses Puro. Blanc screwed it up.

Otherwise yeah, I feel comfortable with Spain than Italy for host of reasons.
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Puro

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by Puro on Wed Jun 20, 2012 2:55 pm

Fade out wrote:Enough excuses Puro. Blanc screwed it up.

Otherwise yeah, I feel comfortable with Spain than Italy for host of reasons.

Blanc is a cunning c**t. I give him credit for fooling almost an entire country that he lost to Sweden fair and square. If you are French, then you'd know you beat Sweden without breaking a sweat.
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Fade out

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by Fade out on Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:07 pm

That's not true. Sweden took a lead vs Ukr and England too, but lost. They finally used Ibra as a lone striker, using him on Rami-Mexes, our weakest area. That brought them the lead.

Our attack didn't cause any problems because of some poor long range shooting from HBA and Karim. Menez came on and our attack improved dramatically. Bobo should know how he used to wait for the ball to his feet, but now has improved his off the ball runs for others to find. He was put through 1 v 1 but his shot hit the foot of GK. I'd have started him and rested Ribery (who was bright again). Nasri in front of Diarra-M'Vila rather than Cabaye-M'Vila, is a significant downgrade in terms of quick passing and tempo change. We brought on Giroud late. Don't know why Blanc is proving to be a c**t with his selections. He waited and waited for Mexes himself to get suspended. Don't forget that Swedes could have been 2-0 up with mistakes from both CB. And then he waited and waited, bringing on Malouda. And taking off M'Vila later on. Leaving Diarra on. That was shit management. He has all the tools, but his choices were all incompetent. He can't fool anyone, he proved to be incompetent against Swedes, not willingly losing the game.
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Puro

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by Puro on Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:12 pm

Fade out wrote:That's not true. Sweden took a lead vs Ukr and England too, but lost. They finally used Ibra as a lone striker, using him on Rami-Mexes, our weakest area. That brought them the lead.

Our attack didn't cause any problems because of some poor long range shooting from HBA and Karim. Menez came on and our attack improved dramatically. Bobo should know how he used to wait for the ball to his feet, but now has improved his off the ball runs for others to find. He was put through 1 v 1 but his shot hit the foot of GK. I'd have started him and rested Ribery (who was bright again). Nasri in front of Diarra-M'Vila rather than Cabaye-M'Vila, is a significant downgrade in terms of quick passing and tempo change. We brought on Giroud late. Don't know why Blanc is proving to be a c**t with his selections. He waited and waited for Mexes himself to get suspended. Don't forget that Swedes could have been 2-0 up with mistakes from both CB. And then he waited and waited, bringing on Malouda. And taking off M'Vila later on. Leaving Diarra on. That was shit management. He has all the tools, but his choices were all incompetent. He can't fool anyone, he proved to be incompetent against Swedes, not willingly losing the game.

Blanc was undefeated for over twenty games, and he loses to Sweden (France's bitch!). IF you find yourself in a position to choose between España and Italia in the KO stages of a major football tournament, which one would you choose to play against?
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Fade out

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by Fade out on Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:15 pm

PuroReturns wrote:
Fade out wrote:That's not true. Sweden took a lead vs Ukr and England too, but lost. They finally used Ibra as a lone striker, using him on Rami-Mexes, our weakest area. That brought them the lead.

Our attack didn't cause any problems because of some poor long range shooting from HBA and Karim. Menez came on and our attack improved dramatically. Bobo should know how he used to wait for the ball to his feet, but now has improved his off the ball runs for others to find. He was put through 1 v 1 but his shot hit the foot of GK. I'd have started him and rested Ribery (who was bright again). Nasri in front of Diarra-M'Vila rather than Cabaye-M'Vila, is a significant downgrade in terms of quick passing and tempo change. We brought on Giroud late. Don't know why Blanc is proving to be a c**t with his selections. He waited and waited for Mexes himself to get suspended. Don't forget that Swedes could have been 2-0 up with mistakes from both CB. And then he waited and waited, bringing on Malouda. And taking off M'Vila later on. Leaving Diarra on. That was shit management. He has all the tools, but his choices were all incompetent. He can't fool anyone, he proved to be incompetent against Swedes, not willingly losing the game.

Blanc was undefeated for over twenty games, and he loses to Sweden (France's bitch!). IF you find yourself in a position to choose between España and Italia in the KO stages of a major football tournament, which one would you choose to play against?

Historically as well as in terms of our style, of course, Spain.

But to lose his undefeated run, and to make the team look disjointed from GK to striker, taking away all the confidence, would be a fatal cost.
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bluenine

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by bluenine on Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:21 pm

Pirlo wrote:Well, v.difficult game for us, defensively we need to be able to cope with high balls into the box, and in attack we need to be very clinical and take changes against the mass defence, and we've not bee particularly good at either in this tournament so far,

I would like to see Nocerino play in midfield, otherwise we take the pitch with 10 italiani and a DONKEY II. Tactically, we could see another shift in emphasis from Prandelli, and i wouldn't be against this, in the last 10 years we really struggle against the english style of play, so we need to have a really good game to progress,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_RrvNaELAjE channel the vince!

Pirlo, while I have also preferred Nocerino to Motta for this game (Italy need his physical/defensive strengths), you are being very harsh on Motta. He is no "donkey", and probably the best Pirlo back up in the team (more effective than Montolivo). He was quite average in the last game, but so were Pirlo and Marchisio. And even then he did have a moment or two - I remember the backheel one-two with Cassano which created a clear goal chance for Di Natale. Motta is quite talented, more so than Nocerino. But Italy need the fresher legs, workrate, and physicality of Nocerino for this particular game.

Again, for someone who likes pretty football, it is surprising that you like Nocerino and think Motta is the donkey. Razz
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Puro

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by Puro on Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:22 pm

Fade out wrote:
Historically as well as in terms of our style, of course, Spain.

But to lose his undefeated run, and to make the team look disjointed from GK to striker, taking away all the confidence, would be a fatal cost.

Of course! everything else is hogwash by Blanc. It was a worthy risk! Now France has winnable games against España and Portugal/Czechia.

Blanc saw that going up against Italia and then against Germany (provided they beat Greece) was too tough a road to take.

France handed the group to England on a silver platter. What a cunning c**t Blanc is! Smart man! He's looking the road ahead.


Last edited by PuroReturns on Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:42 pm; edited 1 time in total
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debaser

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by debaser on Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:32 pm

Well, the real question is: if Blanc has such control over the match, why not get a draw rather than a loss?

This would get them the benefits of going into the Spain half of the draw, without risking being eliminated, as well as losing their unbeaten run and potentially affecting the confidence of the players.

Surely you want your players confident and scoring goals going into a game against Spain. Going 2-0 down early and then coming back for a 2-2 draw would've been best of both worlds and if he were a truly cunning coach with complete control of the situation, this is what he would've done. As he didn't I can only conclude the loss was a genuine loss (or an attempted draw gone wrong) Ale
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S4P

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by S4P on Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:38 pm

If this were Hodgson, you'd be calling him a coward for deliberately avoiding Italia and Germany. Ale
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Puro

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by Puro on Wed Jun 20, 2012 3:44 pm

S4P wrote:If this were Hodgson, you'd be calling him a coward for deliberately avoiding Italia and Germany. Ale

He's already a dull, boring, insipid, limited, pussy football coward. Everyone knows that already. There's no need for me to call him out personally. <Ale>
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Super Progress

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by Super Progress on Wed Jun 20, 2012 4:02 pm

fcb wrote:
Super Danmark wrote:

Come on France do it for PROGRESS


Stop trying to drag any and every team that's not Spain or Barcelona into your net lol!

France don't fit any of the criteria of your 'progress' bandwagon.
You silly non progressive man. It is a case of the lesser of two evils.

This is why Team Progress is also pragmatic. I can adjust as terms and times changes. Great advantage to have. <Ale>

So far though Greece going through was a major victory for the movement. England too has been a valuable asset and they topped their group over France. Italy is my Laudrup(along with Denmark) and I will generally support them no matter what but they have had a rather balanced approach so far. Germany too although they are being credited as being an anti progressive side which has not be the case so far in this tournament imo. Portugal play with 3 midfielders who are pretty withdrawn and hit teams on the counter. Holland going out wasn't a particular loss since van Marwijk went from good progressive virtues in 2010 to being open and expansive in 2012. They got their just punishment.

2012-The Year Of Progress <Ale>

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by worms. on Wed Jun 20, 2012 4:17 pm

Looking forward to our game vs France as well,hopefully they will be one of the handful of teams who will actually try and play football against us.
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Puro

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by Puro on Wed Jun 20, 2012 4:23 pm

Super Balenced wrote:Looking forward to our game vs France as well,hopefully they will be one of the handful of teams who will actually try and play football against us.

I may take a bet with France. I'm getting 5.0 with France. Spain's priced at 1.85. France is a huge underdog according to the house. Biggrin <Ale>
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debaser

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by debaser on Wed Jun 20, 2012 4:24 pm

Puro, you're a man with all the answers, so why you avoiding my question: why did France chose to lose rather than draw?

worms.

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by worms. on Wed Jun 20, 2012 4:24 pm

Super Danmark wrote:
fcb wrote:
Super Danmark wrote:

Come on France do it for PROGRESS


Stop trying to drag any and every team that's not Spain or Barcelona into your net lol!

France don't fit any of the criteria of your 'progress' bandwagon.
You silly non progressive man. It is a case of the lesser of two evils.

This is why Team Progress is also pragmatic. I can adjust as terms and times changes. Great advantage to have. <Ale>

So far though Greece going through was a major victory for the movement. England too has been a valuable asset and they topped their group over France. Italy is my Laudrup(along with Denmark) and I will generally support them no matter what but they have had a rather balanced approach so far. Germany too although they are being credited as being an anti progressive side which has not be the case so far in this tournament imo. Portugal play with 3 midfielders who are pretty withdrawn and hit teams on the counter. Holland going out wasn't a particular loss since van Marwijk went from good progressive virtues in 2010 to being open and expansive in 2012. They got their just punishment.

2012-The Year Of Progress <Ale>

Italia,Us(Spain) and Germany are the most balanced teams left in the tournament.A hope we/they all win their matches for PROGRESS to be victorious.THIS is the year Balance will reign supreme.

SUPER BALANCED TEAMS FTW!PROGRESS 2012.

.
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Puro

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by Puro on Wed Jun 20, 2012 4:41 pm

debaser wrote:Puro, you're a man with all the answers, so why you avoiding my question: why did France chose to lose rather than draw?

No, I don't have all the answers. If I did, the banksters wouldn't rule, but I'm working on it.

Now, France didn't choose to lose, Blanc just wanted to finish second. France tried to not lose the game and tried to tie it, but got caught at the death and suffered the second goal. At any rate, Blanc got his wish...España. <Ale>
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Fey

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by Fey on Wed Jun 20, 2012 4:44 pm

FUCK FRANCE!

No, seriously! Fuck them. If only they could get a result against Sweden we would have fuckin had Spain and Czech till the final. Now we have to play Italy and Germany first. Would have preferred Germany in the final cause they are the easiest to beat in that round. BUT noooo, thanks to Fucking France its a no go. Still England-Italy never happens so in the end im allright with it, though Englands next friendly is against...Very Happy

Still Carroll against all those Smallini's should be EASY! We are gonna out Italian the Italians! This tie is 85-15 in the favour of England! Pens, ET, easy 2-0, not sure of that but im sure we will get a semi against:



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Puro

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by Puro on Wed Jun 20, 2012 4:52 pm

Told you them Dutchies were out as soon as their group was revealed.
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S4P

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by S4P on Wed Jun 20, 2012 5:22 pm

Let's not forget that you also came up with this gem of a prediction before the draw was made:

PuroReturns wrote:
Murray wrote:Hopefully England will get a really hard group so they are knocked out as quickly as possible.

Then you want to see them against France, Sweden, and the hosts Ukraine. Bye Bye England! lol! <Ale>

http://www.europeanboard.net/t23508-euro-2012-draw

Post 13 Very Happy Ale
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Puro

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by Puro on Wed Jun 20, 2012 5:24 pm

S4P wrote:Let's not forget you came up with this gem before the draw was made:

PuroReturns wrote:
Murray wrote:Hopefully England will get a really hard group so they are knocked out as quickly as possible.

Then you want to see them against France, Sweden, and the hosts Ukraine. Bye Bye England! lol! <Ale>

http://www.europeanboard.net/t23508-euro-2012-draw

Post 13 Very Happy Ale

England were dominated and clearly second best in all three games though. Football, Fucking Hell! Biggrin <Ale>
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debaser

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by debaser on Wed Jun 20, 2012 5:29 pm

S4P wrote:Let's not forget that you also came up with this gem of a prediction before the draw was made:

PuroReturns wrote:
Murray wrote:Hopefully England will get a really hard group so they are knocked out as quickly as possible.

Then you want to see them against France, Sweden, and the hosts Ukraine. Bye Bye England! lol! <Ale>

http://www.europeanboard.net/t23508-euro-2012-draw

Post 13 Very Happy Ale

Talk about getting it spectacularly right and spectacularly wrong at the same time. Well done on guessing the random draw Puro, shame about the football expertise lol! lol! lol!
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Lusitan

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by Lusitan on Wed Jun 20, 2012 5:58 pm

Hi guys, been absent due to too much work. Couldn't even watch the match against Holland due to travel.

I've been reading your comments, it's good to see some of you are in good shape Wink I was a bit surprised by some Dutch supporters who i thought were Germans but hey, i'm getting older and my memory plays some tricks Smile

As for the competition it went as expected. I really think our team is strong and can beat any team in this tournament but we must have the best CR for that since we have the likes of Postiga up front Very Happy

Too much respect against Germany in the first match, not taking any chances and only starting playing after suffering one goal. Our usual scoring difficulties prevented the tie.

Against Denmark we didn't defend that good, those 2 goals shouldn't have been allowed, and if CR played his normal he would have scored those 2 goals easily. Good thing others scored.

Against Holland (disappointing performance, Huntelar in the bench in the first matches WTF??) once again it took taking a goal to react. Good thing it was in the beginning of the game unlike against Germany. Wink

As for the next match it'll be hard but if we play our regular (it's not always guaranteed) we should win.

I saw in some comments calls for Quaresma. We all know he is very talented but he never played well in the Selecção, he is very unstable. Varela offers at the moment more guarantees.

I'll try to pop in tomorrow, stay well guys. <Ale>

PS: So proud of the 10 players present there from Sporting Portugal's school cheers
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Effenberg

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by Effenberg on Wed Jun 20, 2012 6:24 pm

Why are there referees from England, Italy and Portugal assigned to KO matches although those countries are still in the tournament? Did they change the rules? I thought starting from the quarterfinals countries that are still playing can't have a ref in as well.
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Jaime

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

Post by Jaime on Wed Jun 20, 2012 7:02 pm

Lusitan wrote:Hi guys, been absent due to too much work. Couldn't even watch the match against Holland due to travel.

I've been reading your comments, it's good to see some of you are in good shape Wink I was a bit surprised by some Dutch supporters who i thought were Germans but hey, i'm getting older and my memory plays some tricks Smile

As for the competition it went as expected. I really think our team is strong and can beat any team in this tournament but we must have the best CR for that since we have the likes of Postiga up front Very Happy

Too much respect against Germany in the first match, not taking any chances and only starting playing after suffering one goal. Our usual scoring difficulties prevented the tie.

Against Denmark we didn't defend that good, those 2 goals shouldn't have been allowed, and if CR played his normal he would have scored those 2 goals easily. Good thing others scored.

Against Holland (disappointing performance, Huntelar in the bench in the first matches WTF??) once again it took taking a goal to react. Good thing it was in the beginning of the game unlike against Germany. Wink

As for the next match it'll be hard but if we play our regular (it's not always guaranteed) we should win.

I saw in some comments calls for Quaresma. We all know he is very talented but he never played well in the Selecção, he is very unstable. Varela offers at the moment more guarantees.

I'll try to pop in tomorrow, stay well guys. <Ale>

PS: So proud of the 10 players present there from Sporting Portugal's school cheers

Nice to see you back around Lusitan. You should have a good chance against Czech Republic. Take care! Ale

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Re: EURO 2012 Quarter Finals

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    Current date/time is Mon Jun 26, 2017 3:00 am