EURO 2012 Semi Finals

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bluenine

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by bluenine on Fri Jun 29, 2012 12:48 am

worms. wrote:Germany miss a world class DM,someone like Busquets or Masch.Plus a LB so Lahm can play RB.

I don't think the Germans miss any talents, I think they miss a little experience to manage big games. Germany have better talents than this Italy, the difference was in attitude and application.

They are a young side, they will get there.

And yeah, Khedira > Busquets. Busquets is seriously over rated when people put him among the best DMs on the planet.

A & K

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by A & K on Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:12 am

Pirlo wrote:This is just surreal, can't believe we're in the final, and have played so well since the Group stages, when the competition started, we've really turned up and played some great football that Prandelli before had only promised.

The pride is back, the belief is back, the 2010 Lippi doom is gone cheers

Even reaching the final is a fantastic acheivement, to utterly dominate and crush Germany again, and it should have been far more than 2-1, we are a top european nation again.

As an apology to Cesare, i promised i'd change, so <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Still some issues though, still no Giovinco, i'd have fancied seeing him run at that german defence on the counter, and ffs stop bringing Diamanti on!!! Doh

But the pride is back, and already we have had a great tournament and at least proved we are still better than Germany. Mario turned up when it mattered, and Pirlo is still a God with the ball as his bread and fish.

To beat Spain and actually win the whole cup would be a dream. Dare we dream?

Not quite 2006, but still a great night!


Big congrats Pirlo!! This shows experience really help. I hope you win it. Who would have thought about this after the severe defeat 0-3 against Russia prior the tournament?
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debaser

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by debaser on Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:14 am

@bluenine:

They have a young team/squad, but their players are very experienced for their age at international level, if you look at number of caps:

Neuer 31 caps
Boateng 25
Badstuber 25
Hummels 19
Lahm 91
Khedira 32
Schweinsteiger 95
Kroos 30
Podolski 101
Ozil 38
Gomez 57

= 544 caps (avg = 49.4)

+ Klose 121, Muller 32, Reus 8

Compare Italy:

Buffon 119
Chiellini 54
Balzaretti 11
Barzagli 32
Bonucci 19
Pirlo 88
De Rossi 77
Marchisio 25
Montolivo 36
Cassano 34
Balotelli 13

= 508 caps (avg = 46.1)

+ Motta 12, Di Natale 41, Diamanti 4

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by worms. on Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:14 am

Lol no way is Kedira better than Busquets,Kedira doesn't even play DM for Germany anyway,he plays as a box to box midfielder.
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bluenine

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by bluenine on Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:42 am

No doubt about that, Deb, I had written an article on that pre-tournament - but am too embarrassed to provide a link, as it says good things about Holland and Sweden. Sometimes caps mean nothing. Its about attitude and mentality.

I remember Klinnsman/Vialli talking about how this German side is different from the ones in the past - they are multi-cultural, and hence you see far more creativity rather than the predictable style of old. But something far more important is lost in that multi-culturality, the passion and mentality of those previous German sides haven't really been passed on to this generation. The German teams of the last century WOULD have come back from 2-0, in their own predictable manner. This one never looked like it would. (this is not an argument against having multi-cultural teams, not at all, just that some traditions need to be passed on - How, I do not know)

One thing that this Italian side has in its favour, is that they have that same DNA of previous generations (though admitedly not the same talent). The mentality. They believe they can win it, and do it in their own way.

Its this mentality which makes traditional teams like Brasil, Italy and Germany win so often. Unfortunately, the Germans have lost that, and fortunately the Italians haven't.

Maybe I am not making any sense. I blame the drinks and the late hour!

debaser wrote:@bluenine:

They have a young team/squad, but their players are very experienced for their age at international level, if you look at number of caps:

Neuer 31 caps
Boateng 25
Badstuber 25
Hummels 19
Lahm 91
Khedira 32
Schweinsteiger 95
Kroos 30
Podolski 101
Ozil 38
Gomez 57

= 544 caps (avg = 49.4)

+ Klose 121, Muller 32, Reus 8

Compare Italy:

Buffon 119
Chiellini 54
Balzaretti 11
Barzagli 32
Bonucci 19
Pirlo 88
De Rossi 77
Marchisio 25
Montolivo 36
Cassano 34
Balotelli 13

= 508 caps (avg = 46.1)

+ Motta 12, Di Natale 41, Diamanti 4
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bluenine

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by bluenine on Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:43 am

worms. wrote:Lol no way is Kedira better than Busquets,Kedira doesn't even play DM for Germany anyway,he plays as a box to box midfielder.
De Rossi doesn't play DM either, but as a DM, De Rossi > Busquets.

You hype the Biscuit way too much.
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Murray

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by Murray on Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:53 am

The Germans have definitely lost that extreme self confidence & arrogance that they used to have.

Like this for example. Can't imagine the current players doing that.

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messiah

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by messiah on Fri Jun 29, 2012 2:07 am

De rossi is boss who doesn't he play DM for Italy or Roma.
I wonder if he would start for barca or spain, I'm thinking no
I wonder how many would have guessed masch wouldnt be able to get a game for us when he signed
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ERIK LAMELA

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by ERIK LAMELA on Fri Jun 29, 2012 3:32 am

CA$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$H, mes amis!
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Jaime

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by Jaime on Fri Jun 29, 2012 4:34 am

messiah wrote:De rossi is boss who doesn't he play DM for Italy or Roma.
I wonder if he would start for barca or spain, I'm thinking no
I wonder how many would have guessed masch wouldnt be able to get a game for us when he signed

He wasn't playing at all until Pepito was out of centre backs (since all he signed was Henriques and Chygrinskiys) and even though he's pretty sh!t at centre back he's better than Muniesa ffs. Anyway, if Mascherano played as a midfielder he would play about 4 minutes all season long.
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ERIK LAMELA

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by ERIK LAMELA on Fri Jun 29, 2012 4:54 am

Before the tournament started, Puro contacted me due to the South American connection (the Argies and Peruvians have always been friends):

"Andr the Giant" he said to me.

"Yes Puro" I replied.

"Get your money on the Italiani to win the cup and Balotelli to finish top scorer." he told me

"But Puro,NOBODY is tipping the Italiani, and Balotelli might not even PLAY!" I said to him.

"Trust me... it's EASY CA$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$HHHHHHHHHHHHH" said Puro, before taking off his shirt and waving it around his head like so: Whoop

Truer words have never been spoken, mes amis.

Bernd can sit and joke about putting money on Spain to win three tournaments before 2012, suggesting that Puro and I are liars who aggrandise our achievements online. But he, and all the other Teutons, are simply in denial about their dismissal from the tournament at the hands of a black man adopted by Jews playing for the latini.

Don't worry Bernd, I will buy you a nice present with all the CA$$$$$$$$$$$$HHHHHHHHHHH I am set to make (especially when my own tip of Pirlo for player of the tournament pays out).
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Romford Pele

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by Romford Pele on Fri Jun 29, 2012 6:15 am

Balotelli is so fucking awesome. I can understand why Kimbo doesn't like him but this guy has all the ability in the world. Please please please learn to keep your head Mario, you can definitely become the best striker in the world. Much more potential than Aguero ok
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Pras_tama

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by Pras_tama on Fri Jun 29, 2012 6:36 am

Romford Pele wrote:Balotelli is so fucking awesome. I can understand why Kimbo doesn't like him but this guy has all the ability in the world. Please please please learn to keep your head Mario, you can definitely become the best striker in the world. Much more potential than Aguero ok

I have a feeling that if Balo kept his head he won't be as good as we expect

Balo doesn't keep his head > Balo keeps his head
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bluenine

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by bluenine on Fri Jun 29, 2012 8:26 am

messiah wrote:De rossi is boss who doesn't he play DM for Italy or Roma.
I wonder if he would start for barca or spain, I'm thinking no
I wonder how many would have guessed masch wouldnt be able to get a game for us when he signed

I don't think the best way to judge players is to check how well they would suit the tiki-taka at Barca. IMO players who can boss a few systems > players who suit one.

That said, De Rossi has better passing ability than Masch, and would probably suit Barca more. Whether he would start over Busquets at Barca, I guess we will never know. IMO he would start over Busquets in most systems, for me he is a better player and better DM.
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Fade out

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by Fade out on Fri Jun 29, 2012 8:40 am

De Rossi could play more varied roles IMO. He's playing a combative cover midfielder ahead of Pirlo, than a pure DM by positional sense (but all 'Pirlo as regista' systems deploy this tactic). That's what our resident Jamaican is saying, Bluey.

Busquets plays behind Xabi and Xavi, more akin to a DM.

As for a CM pairing of Busquets-DDR, I think it would make Busquets to play more like DLP (without the long passing) and it would let DDR play more of a box to box midfielder.

Both very good players. But Bluey makes a potent point regarding adaptability to different systems. Think the Spanish/Barca contingent will always get overhyped individually..
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christmasborocooper

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by christmasborocooper on Fri Jun 29, 2012 8:47 am

Romford Pele wrote:Balotelli is so fucking awesome. I can understand why Kimbo doesn't like him but this guy has all the ability in the world. Please please please learn to keep your head Mario, you can definitely become the best striker in the world. Much more potential than Aguero ok

Aguero is years older than him and I would've said plays in a different way..how come they're geting compared?
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Fade out

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by Fade out on Fri Jun 29, 2012 8:51 am

christmasborocooper wrote:
Romford Pele wrote:Balotelli is so fucking awesome. I can understand why Kimbo doesn't like him but this guy has all the ability in the world. Please please please learn to keep your head Mario, you can definitely become the best striker in the world. Much more potential than Aguero ok

Aguero is years older than him and I would've said plays in a different way..how come they're geting compared?

Coz they play in center forward position. Aguero has more to his game IMO, but Balotelli as a CF might have everything that could ask for.. He reminds me of a young Mexes, with every attribute to become the best in the world. But Mexes didn't fullfil his potential and turned out to be inconsistent through out his career, same (or worse) could happen to Mario.
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christmasborocooper

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by christmasborocooper on Fri Jun 29, 2012 9:00 am

Well..I would've said Aguero was quicker, just as good a finisher, just as tricky if not more so..but Balotelli is stronger. I don't think there's that much in it to say that he's got "loads more potential". Pretty sure Aguero was said to have "loads of potential" when he was 21 as well.
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the real white worm

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by the real white worm on Fri Jun 29, 2012 9:05 am

Fade out wrote:
christmasborocooper wrote:
Romford Pele wrote:Balotelli is so fucking awesome. I can understand why Kimbo doesn't like him but this guy has all the ability in the world. Please please please learn to keep your head Mario, you can definitely become the best striker in the world. Much more potential than Aguero ok

Aguero is years older than him and I would've said plays in a different way..how come they're geting compared?

Coz they play in center forward position. Aguero has more to his game IMO, but Balotelli as a CF might have everything that could ask for.. He reminds me of a young Mexes, with every attribute to become the best in the world. But Mexes didn't fullfil his potential and turned out to be inconsistent through out his career, same (or worse) could happen to Mario.

Maxes is a defender and Balotelli is a striker you facking retard!
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bluenine

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by bluenine on Fri Jun 29, 2012 9:12 am

Fade out wrote:De Rossi could play more varied roles IMO. He's playing a combative cover midfielder ahead of Pirlo, than a pure DM by positional sense (but all 'Pirlo as regista' systems deploy this tactic). That's what our resident Jamaican is saying, Bluey.

Busquets plays behind Xabi and Xavi, more akin to a DM.

As for a CM pairing of Busquets-DDR, I think it would make Busquets to play more like DLP (without the long passing) and it would let DDR play more of a box to box midfielder.

Both very good players. But Bluey makes a potent point regarding adaptability to different systems. Think the Spanish/Barca contingent will always get overhyped individually..

I know, Fade. I started the argument with "De Rossi doesn't play DM, but...." Smile

The point is, De Rossi can play a great DM when needed. And as we saw against Spain, he does a decent sweeper impression too.
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Fade out

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by Fade out on Fri Jun 29, 2012 9:23 am

Super Balenced wrote:
Fade out wrote:
christmasborocooper wrote:
Romford Pele wrote:Balotelli is so fucking awesome. I can understand why Kimbo doesn't like him but this guy has all the ability in the world. Please please please learn to keep your head Mario, you can definitely become the best striker in the world. Much more potential than Aguero ok

Aguero is years older than him and I would've said plays in a different way..how come they're geting compared?

Coz they play in center forward position. Aguero has more to his game IMO, but Balotelli as a CF might have everything that could ask for.. He reminds me of a young Mexes, with every attribute to become the best in the world. But Mexes didn't fullfil his potential and turned out to be inconsistent through out his career, same (or worse) could happen to Mario.

Maxes is a defender and Balotelli is a striker you facking retard!

Expected you to miss the point, WUM
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Fade out

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by Fade out on Fri Jun 29, 2012 9:25 am

bluenine wrote:
Fade out wrote:De Rossi could play more varied roles IMO. He's playing a combative cover midfielder ahead of Pirlo, than a pure DM by positional sense (but all 'Pirlo as regista' systems deploy this tactic). That's what our resident Jamaican is saying, Bluey.

Busquets plays behind Xabi and Xavi, more akin to a DM.

As for a CM pairing of Busquets-DDR, I think it would make Busquets to play more like DLP (without the long passing) and it would let DDR play more of a box to box midfielder.

Both very good players. But Bluey makes a potent point regarding adaptability to different systems. Think the Spanish/Barca contingent will always get overhyped individually..

I know, Fade. I started the argument with "De Rossi doesn't play DM, but...." Smile

The point is, De Rossi can play a great DM when needed. And as we saw against Spain, he does a decent sweeper impression too.

In reply to Worms, could see why I missed that post.. Very Happy
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the real white worm

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by the real white worm on Fri Jun 29, 2012 9:28 am

Fade out wrote:
Super Balenced wrote:
Fade out wrote:
christmasborocooper wrote:
Romford Pele wrote:Balotelli is so fucking awesome. I can understand why Kimbo doesn't like him but this guy has all the ability in the world. Please please please learn to keep your head Mario, you can definitely become the best striker in the world. Much more potential than Aguero ok

Aguero is years older than him and I would've said plays in a different way..how come they're geting compared?

Coz they play in center forward position. Aguero has more to his game IMO, but Balotelli as a CF might have everything that could ask for.. He reminds me of a young Mexes, with every attribute to become the best in the world. But Mexes didn't fullfil his potential and turned out to be inconsistent through out his career, same (or worse) could happen to Mario.

Maxes is a defender and Balotelli is a striker you facking retard!


Expected you to miss the point, WUM

why do you have a picture of a topless man as your avatar? homo
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Tarun

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by Tarun on Fri Jun 29, 2012 9:40 am

For all the praise that many other players up the field are deservedly getting I think Bonucci and Barzagli had a great game yesterday. To have kept this attacking German side at bay is a feat...and these two were there. We know that penalty off Balzaretti was way too harsh but otherwise he had a great game too while playing out of position (i'm gonna take this opportunity to say F*#ck Secco once again)

Barzagli's and Chiellini's talent was never at doubt but with this tournament Bonucci has announced himself strongly. Maybe this defense is not as classy as the older Italian generation but if I was to compare it with the current line up of defenders across competing countries...they measure up very well
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bluenine

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by bluenine on Fri Jun 29, 2012 9:55 am

Tarun wrote:For all the praise that many other players up the field are deservedly getting I think Bonucci and Barzagli had a great game yesterday. To have kept this attacking German side at bay is a feat...and these two were there. We know that penalty off Balzaretti was way too harsh but otherwise he had a great game too while playing out of position (i'm gonna take this opportunity to say F*#ck Secco once again)

Barzagli's and Chiellini's talent was never at doubt but with this tournament Bonucci has announced himself strongly. Maybe this defense is not as classy as the older Italian generation but if I was to compare it with the current line up of defenders across competing countries...they measure up very well

<Ale> Bonucci has done well. He must have come from a top notch academy Razz
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Tarun

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by Tarun on Fri Jun 29, 2012 10:01 am

The top notch academy obviously did not trust him further and now he belongs to us Laughing
bluenine wrote:
Tarun wrote:For all the praise that many other players up the field are deservedly getting I think Bonucci and Barzagli had a great game yesterday. To have kept this attacking German side at bay is a feat...and these two were there. We know that penalty off Balzaretti was way too harsh but otherwise he had a great game too while playing out of position (i'm gonna take this opportunity to say F*#ck Secco once again)

Barzagli's and Chiellini's talent was never at doubt but with this tournament Bonucci has announced himself strongly. Maybe this defense is not as classy as the older Italian generation but if I was to compare it with the current line up of defenders across competing countries...they measure up very well

<Ale> Bonucci has done well. He must have come from a top notch academy Razz
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abundance

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by abundance on Fri Jun 29, 2012 10:18 am

cheers cheers cheers cheers cheers

mes amis





Happened to watch the game in kinda awkward conditions so I'm not able to say much about it apart that it felt like a surreal orgasm.

Mamma grazie d'avermi fatto azzurro.

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the real white worm

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by the real white worm on Fri Jun 29, 2012 10:19 am

abundance wrote: cheers cheers cheers cheers cheers

mes amis





Happened to watch the game in kinda awkward conditions so I'm not able to say much about it apart that it felt like a surreal orgasm.
Mamma grazie d'avermi fatto azzurro.


i think i know what you mean lol!
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the real white worm

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by the real white worm on Fri Jun 29, 2012 10:20 am

Bouncci reminds me of cannnaaanvaro in 2006.
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Isco Benny

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Re: EURO 2012 Semi Finals

Post by Isco Benny on Fri Jun 29, 2012 10:36 am

christmasborocooper wrote:Well..I would've said Aguero was quicker, just as good a finisher, just as tricky if not more so..but Balotelli is stronger. I don't think there's that much in it to say that he's got "loads more potential". Pretty sure Aguero was said to have "loads of potential" when he was 21 as well.

ok

It's natural that platitudes are being dished out left,right and centre.

But Balotelli loads more potential than Aguero.... well, that is a laugh.

Nice header, nice run and nice finish yesterday.

But just think of the number of fuck ups this tournament, number of missed chances and of course THAT brain melt moment against Spain.

He still thinks he's much, much better than he actually is.

Take away the intrigue around his personality, his story being a black man in a very much non-black country, strip it ALL away and really ask yourself what you are left with?

I see a talented target man with potential, but nothing close to the apparent "genius" that the Media in this country in particular would have us believe.

I'll leave the genius label for the person who is really deserved of it - big Andy "Andrea" Pirlo of Flero, Lombardy, Italy Ale


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