EURO 2012 Final

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Red n' Black

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by Red n' Black on Fri Jun 29, 2012 2:29 pm

Can't wait for the final, Spain is the better team but it would be nice if Italy can go all the way here. Prandelli is a great coach and a great man, much respect to him.

And I absolutely love how Pirlo is sticking it to every ignorant pundit/hater, they all seem so surprised that he is dominating. Were they just born yesterday or are they simply that clueless?

And of course you're not going to get the best out of him when he plays in the same midfield as two statues (Ronaldinho,Clarence) that just stand and wait for the ball and fullbacks who offer nothing, as was the case post 2007.

Surround him with movement and energetic players and you see the results. But yeah, supposedly Seedorf and Kaka were the ones making him look good and carried him. Laughing
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bluenine

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by bluenine on Fri Jun 29, 2012 2:38 pm

worms. wrote:Just realized the 2 best leagues in the world have their nation in the final. Coincidence?

If by best league you mean the best quality of players, I am afraid I will have to disagree with you. I love Serie A, and will always be biased towards it, but is no where close to the premier league. And behind La Liga and Bundesliga as well. And the worse things is, I think things will get worse before they get any better.

There is no money anymore in the Italian game, even top clubs like Inter and Milan are struggling. We can't even imagine Inter buying a world class player anymore, forget breaking the world transfer fee record like we used to 15 years ago. Even buying a decent player costs 15-20m these days, which is now out of reach for Inter (unless funded by player sales). The only silver lining for Inter is that we have been investing in youth, as well as (hopefully) a new stadium, and once that is done, we will be in a position to mount a come back.

The picture elsewhere in Serie A is worse. Old archaic stadiums which no longer attract most fans, match fixing and betting scandals every year which further isolate the fans, declining revenues from gate receipts, unfavorable tax laws which don't attract the best foreign talent, and failing youth development policies... Serie A is in a state of further decline, everyone can see it. Its a sad state compared to the glorious days of the 90s.

This International hurrah is just a pleasant, momentary distraction from the declining state of the domestic game. Serie A is far from the best anymore, my friend.
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messiah

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by messiah on Fri Jun 29, 2012 2:55 pm

I am thinking Del Bosque should play the 3-4-3 in the Italian game, playing them Man for man in midfield, the back 3 will always have an extra man to cover Italy's front two. and since they don't play with much width when using the 4-3-1-2 you won't have to worry about the defense being stretched.


------Ramos---Pique---Javi

----------Busquets

------Xavi---------Alonso

------------Iniesta

-----Silva----Cesc----Alba

Of course the Italians could then switch to the 3-5-2 and cause some real problems down the flanks, but spain can switch back to it's original formation without making a substitution and i think a back four of Ramos--Pique--Javi--Alba would be better than one with arbeloa anyways.
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Fade out

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by Fade out on Fri Jun 29, 2012 3:01 pm

Hooray, lets change the first choice CB pairing against form striker/strike partnership in EC finals. Michael Cox syndrome Doh
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bluenine

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by bluenine on Fri Jun 29, 2012 3:06 pm

Not sure if its true, but I hear that Spain have not conceeded a goal in the KO rounds of an International tournament since 2006.

Tiki-Takenaccio <Ale>

Coupled that with the fact that the Azzurri are yet to go a goal behind in this competition, and its clear that to win, the Azzurri have to score first. It will be almost impossible to come from behind against this impressive tiki-takenaccio.

worms.

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by worms. on Fri Jun 29, 2012 3:12 pm

All this "Tiki-Takenaccio" is pure jealousy.Just because we know how to defend doesn't mean we defend all game.
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Jaime

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by Jaime on Fri Jun 29, 2012 3:13 pm

messiah wrote:I am thinking Del Bosque should play the 3-4-3 in the Italian game, playing them Man for man in midfield, the back 3 will always have an extra man to cover Italy's front two. and since they don't play with much width when using the 4-3-1-2 you won't have to worry about the defense being stretched.


------Ramos---Pique---Javi

----------Busquets

------Xavi---------Alonso

------------Iniesta

-----Silva----Cesc----Alba

Of course the Italians could then switch to the 3-5-2 and cause some real problems down the flanks, but spain can switch back to it's original formation without making a substitution and i think a back four of Ramos--Pique--Javi--Alba would be better than one with arbeloa anyways.

I don't think it makes sense to completely change the scheme to one that the players are not familiar with. All of the evidence from Barcelona suggests that 3-4-3 is a disaster waiting to happen. The only change I would make is I would play Pedro from the start. It will probably be for Silva who has not been at his best since the group stages. Although if I were VDB I would consider dropping Xavi who has been well below par this entire tournament. Since the first game agains Italy where he scored but did not play great imo, Cesc has been doing a very good job and I would keep him as the false 9.

worms.

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by worms. on Fri Jun 29, 2012 3:17 pm

Yep Pedro for Silva please.But I think Xavi should play,he struggled against Portugal because they are physical and highly energetic team and he is struggling with fatigue.But against Italy he is the type of player you want,intelligent in possession and positioning,even when he's not at his best.

Del Bosque would be wise to stick to the same formation and not make the same mistake as Loew and change the teams structure to try and match Italy somehow.
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The Easter Bunny

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by The Easter Bunny on Fri Jun 29, 2012 3:28 pm

[quote="bluenine"]
worms. wrote:Just realized the 2 best leagues in the world have their nation in the final. Coincidence?

lol!

worms.

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by worms. on Fri Jun 29, 2012 4:04 pm

http://www.zonalmarking.net/2012/06/29/italy-2-1-germany-balotelli-double/

As you can see Italy have 4 or 5 in midfield with Cassano dropping deep and to the left a lot of the time.This is a good game for Arbeloa by the way who is really strong defensively.Also it must be said since the first game Ramos and Pique have improved as a partnership,their chemistry and understanding is a lot better and it looks good for the future.

These are the type of games were are abundance of midfielders is a big positive because Italy play with so many central players.I wouldn't be surprised if Silva starts for this reason.So we have 5 or 6 midfielders vs their 4 or 5.

But I would pick Pedro,against Italy in the GS we hardly created anything until Navas and Torres come on,but starting with both could possibly give Italy dominance in midfield.So I would sort of go inbetween both them options and play a player who is in great form,high workrate,goal threat and offers pace in behind to compensate for Fabregas coming deep....

This player is Pedro.We seen how great the Fabregas - Pedro connection can be against Portugal,Fab comes deep and Pedro as the inside winger makes a brilliant run.

So this would be my choice for the final:

--------------C---------
Arbeloa-Pique--Ramos--Alba

------Busquets
---------------Alonso
------------Xavi
---------------------Iniesta
--Pedro----Fabregas

Note how Busquets plays on Cassanos side,I trust Busquets,Arbeoloa and Pique to be able to handle Cassano.I think this side is perfect to play against them,keeping more or less the same team that has been so solid and adding more of a direct threat to trouble Italy in behind instead of Silva.

It will be tough though,we Spanish teams always struggle against Italian teams.Our slow build up play works to their advantage,that's why Italian teams have struggled against English teams the last 5 years,because they are direct and don't give Italian teams the time to get into their defensive shape.


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Jaime

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by Jaime on Fri Jun 29, 2012 4:08 pm

WORMS TALKING SENSE!!!!! cheers

I think that is the lineup that Del Bosque will put out there. For me Torres only looked good against the Irish and well its the Irish. Negredo looked awful against Portugal. Llorente, well, I think he is either in Del Bosque's dog house for some reason or he really does have physical problems. Cesc is the best option up front.
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messiah

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by messiah on Fri Jun 29, 2012 4:20 pm

that's the line up that everyone wants and expects, with pedro starting, I doubt Del bosque will change it though for the same reason you mentioned, he wants to flood the midfield, and use Navas and pedro around the 70th min, to expose tired defenses.

But I hope he changes it and go with pedro, he gives them that cutting edge and vertical movement the team lacks,he is good in possession as well and really helps out in defense.
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Fade out

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by Fade out on Fri Jun 29, 2012 4:46 pm

bluenine wrote:
worms. wrote:Just realized the 2 best leagues in the world have their nation in the final. Coincidence?

If by best league you mean the best quality of players, I am afraid I will have to disagree with you. I love Serie A, and will always be biased towards it, but is no where close to the premier league. And behind La Liga and Bundesliga as well. And the worse things is, I think things will get worse before they get any better.

There is no money anymore in the Italian game, even top clubs like Inter and Milan are struggling. We can't even imagine Inter buying a world class player anymore, forget breaking the world transfer fee record like we used to 15 years ago. Even buying a decent player costs 15-20m these days, which is now out of reach for Inter (unless funded by player sales). The only silver lining for Inter is that we have been investing in youth, as well as (hopefully) a new stadium, and once that is done, we will be in a position to mount a come back.

The picture elsewhere in Serie A is worse. Old archaic stadiums which no longer attract most fans, match fixing and betting scandals every year which further isolate the fans, declining revenues from gate receipts, unfavorable tax laws which don't attract the best foreign talent, and failing youth development policies... Serie A is in a state of further decline, everyone can see it. Its a sad state compared to the glorious days of the 90s.

This International hurrah is just a pleasant, momentary distraction from the declining state of the domestic game. Serie A is far from the best anymore, my friend.

In deed. But you wouldn't shut Worms up from mouthing such inanity again..

worms.

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by worms. on Fri Jun 29, 2012 4:56 pm

bluenine wrote:
worms. wrote:Just realized the 2 best leagues in the world have their nation in the final. Coincidence?

If by best league you mean the best quality of players, I am afraid I will have to disagree with you. I love Serie A, and will always be biased towards it, but is no where close to the premier league. And behind La Liga and Bundesliga as well. And the worse things is, I think things will get worse before they get any better.

There is no money anymore in the Italian game, even top clubs like Inter and Milan are struggling. We can't even imagine Inter buying a world class player anymore, forget breaking the world transfer fee record like we used to 15 years ago. Even buying a decent player costs 15-20m these days, which is now out of reach for Inter (unless funded by player sales). The only silver lining for Inter is that we have been investing in youth, as well as (hopefully) a new stadium, and once that is done, we will be in a position to mount a come back.

The picture elsewhere in Serie A is worse. Old archaic stadiums which no longer attract most fans, match fixing and betting scandals every year which further isolate the fans, declining revenues from gate receipts, unfavorable tax laws which don't attract the best foreign talent, and failing youth development policies... Serie A is in a state of further decline, everyone can see it. Its a sad state compared to the glorious days of the 90s.

This International hurrah is just a pleasant, momentary distraction from the declining state of the domestic game. Serie A is far from the best anymore, my friend.

I don't care about money or stadiums.I watch both DPL and Serie A and Serie A has higher quality football,in terms of technique and tactics.Plus it's lack of money is a plus to me when compared to DPl,the DPL has lost it's soul.Plastic clubs have took over due to unearned money,were is the fun in that?
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Super Progress

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by Super Progress on Fri Jun 29, 2012 4:58 pm

bluenine wrote:Not sure if its true, but I hear that Spain have not conceeded a goal in the KO rounds of an International tournament since 2006.

Tiki-Takenaccio <Ale>
The myth that Spain is one of the most exciting teams ever is finally being destroyed

Once again

VINDICATION Ale
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S4P

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by S4P on Fri Jun 29, 2012 5:01 pm

Whereas the scandals that have affected Serie A have had no influence on it losing it's soul. Very Happy
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Fade out

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by Fade out on Fri Jun 29, 2012 5:03 pm

Super Progress 2012 wrote:
bluenine wrote:Not sure if its true, but I hear that Spain have not conceeded a goal in the KO rounds of an International tournament since 2006.

Tiki-Takenaccio <Ale>
The myth that Spain is one of the most exciting teams ever is finally being destroyed

Once again

VINDICATION Ale

ok
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Jaime

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by Jaime on Fri Jun 29, 2012 5:11 pm

Super Progress 2012 wrote:
bluenine wrote:Not sure if its true, but I hear that Spain have not conceeded a goal in the KO rounds of an International tournament since 2006.

Tiki-Takenaccio <Ale>
The myth that Spain is one of the most exciting teams ever is finally being destroyed

Once again

VINDICATION Ale

In that case it seems like you should love Spain!
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Jaime

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by Jaime on Fri Jun 29, 2012 5:12 pm

messiah wrote:that's the line up that everyone wants and expects, with pedro starting, I doubt Del bosque will change it though for the same reason you mentioned, he wants to flood the midfield, and use Navas and pedro around the 70th min, to expose tired defenses.

But I hope he changes it and go with pedro, he gives them that cutting edge and vertical movement the team lacks,he is good in possession as well and really helps out in defense.

He started Pedro in the WC final so you never know. Ale
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bluenine

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by bluenine on Fri Jun 29, 2012 5:28 pm

worms. wrote:
bluenine wrote:
worms. wrote:Just realized the 2 best leagues in the world have their nation in the final. Coincidence?

If by best league you mean the best quality of players, I am afraid I will have to disagree with you. I love Serie A, and will always be biased towards it, but is no where close to the premier league. And behind La Liga and Bundesliga as well. And the worse things is, I think things will get worse before they get any better.

There is no money anymore in the Italian game, even top clubs like Inter and Milan are struggling. We can't even imagine Inter buying a world class player anymore, forget breaking the world transfer fee record like we used to 15 years ago. Even buying a decent player costs 15-20m these days, which is now out of reach for Inter (unless funded by player sales). The only silver lining for Inter is that we have been investing in youth, as well as (hopefully) a new stadium, and once that is done, we will be in a position to mount a come back.

The picture elsewhere in Serie A is worse. Old archaic stadiums which no longer attract most fans, match fixing and betting scandals every year which further isolate the fans, declining revenues from gate receipts, unfavorable tax laws which don't attract the best foreign talent, and failing youth development policies... Serie A is in a state of further decline, everyone can see it. Its a sad state compared to the glorious days of the 90s.

This International hurrah is just a pleasant, momentary distraction from the declining state of the domestic game. Serie A is far from the best anymore, my friend.

I don't care about money or stadiums.I watch both DPL and Serie A and Serie A has higher quality football,in terms of technique and tactics.Plus it's lack of money is a plus to me when compared to DPl,the DPL has lost it's soul.Plastic clubs have took over due to unearned money,were is the fun in that?

As opposed to Milan, Inter, Juve & co only spending what they earn?

Italian clubs have always been bank-rolled by rich businessmen, people like Moratti who have covered Inter's losses of over 800m over the years. Not very different from the business model of English Clubs these days, whats the difference between a Moratti and a Roman? How are they "plastic with unearned money" and Italians are not?

Dude, I love Serie A, I enjoy watching the Italian style of football over the EPL, but your arguments are terrible. If you just stick to tactical variations, the passion, the tradition/culture, you could potentially put forth a credible argument for Serie A.

worms.

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by worms. on Fri Jun 29, 2012 5:30 pm

Italy fans on here are like the German players.Defeatists and pessimists with no fight in them.
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debaser

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by debaser on Fri Jun 29, 2012 5:43 pm

Jaime wrote:
Super Progress 2012 wrote:
bluenine wrote:Not sure if its true, but I hear that Spain have not conceeded a goal in the KO rounds of an International tournament since 2006.

Tiki-Takenaccio <Ale>
The myth that Spain is one of the most exciting teams ever is finally being destroyed

Once again

VINDICATION Ale

In that case it seems like you should love Spain!

Yeah I am starting to be baffled about what Team Progress is all about - I thought it was a love for all things defensive - yet no love for the most purely defensive side in the tournament. Keeping the ball in order to tire out the opposition & prevent them from attacking. It's defence at its purest. Pre-emptive defending.
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Super Progress

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by Super Progress on Fri Jun 29, 2012 5:44 pm

Jaime wrote:
Super Progress 2012 wrote:
bluenine wrote:Not sure if its true, but I hear that Spain have not conceeded a goal in the KO rounds of an International tournament since 2006.

Tiki-Takenaccio <Ale>
The myth that Spain is one of the most exciting teams ever is finally being destroyed

Once again

VINDICATION Ale

In that case it seems like you should love Spain!
Not as long as they stand as a symbol of offensive football.

The only sense in which that is true is that I find their football offensive to my liking.
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Fade out

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by Fade out on Fri Jun 29, 2012 5:56 pm

debaser wrote:
Jaime wrote:
Super Progress 2012 wrote:
bluenine wrote:Not sure if its true, but I hear that Spain have not conceeded a goal in the KO rounds of an International tournament since 2006.

Tiki-Takenaccio <Ale>
The myth that Spain is one of the most exciting teams ever is finally being destroyed

Once again

VINDICATION Ale

In that case it seems like you should love Spain!

Yeah I am starting to be baffled about what Team Progress is all about - I thought it was a love for all things defensive - yet no love for the most purely defensive side in the tournament. Keeping the ball in order to tire out the opposition & prevent them from attacking. It's defence at its purest. Pre-emptive defending.

It's catching on cheers
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Fey

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by Fey on Fri Jun 29, 2012 6:25 pm

Again a 1st groupstage encounter as final! Only at the Euros!

Having said that, team progress must be supporting SPAIN! With their defensive Tiki Takenaccio!

Meanwhile, all freedom fighter, purists, bohemians and cockney gloryhunters will support the Calcio Totalio from Prandelli!

Having said that! If only that ref gave a penalty against Ramos....Germany would have won the title most likely!

Shows again what a weird sport it is!
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Jaime

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by Jaime on Fri Jun 29, 2012 8:12 pm

Just come to realise that I won't be around the EMB for the final. Sad

In any case, if Italy win advanced congratulations to Pirlo, Forza, Bluenine, abundance, Tarun, Black 'n' Red, Bobo and the rest of the Italy contingent (NOT super progress though Wink ).

If Spain manage to do the impossible and win three consecutive international trophies on the trot I would like to dedicate it to the memory of La Saeta Rubia, DeLux, Torrente, and above all The-Frank-Tavern.

Hope it's a great final! Ale
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Fade out

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by Fade out on Fri Jun 29, 2012 8:14 pm

Whatever happened to those folks, especially Torrente?
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Jaime

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by Jaime on Fri Jun 29, 2012 8:25 pm

Fade out wrote:Whatever happened to those folks, especially Torrente?

Torrente was still posting on occasion at the beginning of the season but it's been a while. DeLux I don't remember, I know he was on about a year ago because I remember we were all hoping Celta Vigo would go up for him. LSR has not posted in a very long time. Don't know what ever became of him.
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Fade out

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by Fade out on Fri Jun 29, 2012 8:59 pm

I miss Torrente. He knows to slide tackle the cules here. Very Happy
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messiah

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

Post by messiah on Fri Jun 29, 2012 9:13 pm

Italy 06

---------------Buffon

--Grosso----Cannavaro--Matrix---Zambo

------------Pirlo---Rino

--Camoranesi-----Totti---Perrotta

----------------Toni

Current XI

-----------------Buffon

---Abate----Chiellini---Balzaretti---Barzagli

--------Marchisio---Pirlo---De Rossi

----------------Montolivo

------------Cassano----Mario

I keep hearing this team is so much worst that the 06 team, Man for man their isn't much between them Grosso,Matrix,Perrotta, where nothing special going into the world cup

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Re: EURO 2012 Final

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