U-21 European Championship 2013

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Isco Benny

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by Isco Benny on Fri Jun 14, 2013 5:58 pm

Nobody can claim you germans are not anything but brutally (gleefully) honest when it comes to expressing your own opinions on (sad old state of) English football - shirley you're not asking us to refrain from sharing our own home truths when the shoe is on the other foot? Laughing All I said anyway was Spain > Germany, I don't think is massively controversial or a dastardly example of WUMmery.

Incidentally, you should be thankful I'm no longer on the Teuton bandwagon - I was shrieking my support of Bayern Munchkins like a little fraulein during the CL final against Chelsea, similarly I both put money on and fully backed Germany in Euro2012. And looked what happened on both fronts. Now I'm back being (supposedly) anti-German, Bayern have won the CL and Germany will probably win the World Cup. Don't forget to thank me for it later Ale

PS - Holtby is a Legend. He's even playing like an Englishman (ie massively underwhelmingly) these days
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Fey

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by Fey on Fri Jun 14, 2013 8:48 pm

Thought Holland played much better then they did before, yes they lost 3-0. But at least I've seen a few decent attacks. Though on personal level it was quite shocking to see, how much better Spain individually is. For Holland only Vilhena really stood out, though I thought Clasie wasnt that bad either. The defense was horrible, and it showed once again why bouncers like Fer are obsolete in modern football.

I thought it was THE sign Holland is morally bankrupt when it comes to football when he was allowed to play at 10.Doh  While Spain have a player like Isco there :lol:Whom is more talented then Gotze and Reus combined.
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Super Progress

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by Super Progress on Fri Jun 14, 2013 10:02 pm

What is up with your boy Clasie fey?
The way you were speaking of him he sounded like the next big talent in Holland but he is on the bench for the U-21 and from what I can hear from you the midfield isn't impressive to begin with. Is it merely a manager who isn't down with playing a midget or what?
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Fey

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by Fey on Sat Jun 15, 2013 2:01 pm

He is awesome, but he is now playing under a manager who hates people who are below 1.75m!
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bluenine

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by bluenine on Sat Jun 15, 2013 7:20 pm

Marata scores in the last minutes again... 4 in 4. 

Starting line ups:

Italy U21: BardiDonatiCaldirolaBianchettiReginiFlorenziVerratti, F Rossi, Insigne; Immobile, Borini

Good to see Insigne back, but Marrone & Saponara miss out due to injuries. Very surprised to see Borini start over Gabbiadini... thats a stupid move, Gabbia has been is excellent form. 

Holland U21: Zoet; Van Rhijn, De Vrij, Martins Indi, Blind; Van Ginkel,Strootman; Wijnaldum, Maher, John; L De Jong
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Kimbo

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by Kimbo on Sat Jun 15, 2013 7:23 pm

Borini Laughok
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bluenine

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by bluenine on Sat Jun 15, 2013 7:48 pm

Italy are playing shite... midfield is non-existent. Verratti has been poor, and the possession of Saponara/Marrone is missing. Borini is useless, Gabbiadini needs to come in at HT. And Saponara for Rossi, I don't care if he has to play on crutches.
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messiah

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by messiah on Sat Jun 15, 2013 7:59 pm

its funny how  much the U21 plays like the senior team, even to the point where i have the same frustration with both, in that i want to see, a xavi iniesta link up in midfield for the seniors and thiago isco for the u21, but for the sake of defensive balance neither manager is doing so. it really grinds my gears.

isco,thiago and mendi has been a cut above so far, and morata is showing the same type of talent he did for the u19, a real gift for scoring goals, remains be of morientes.

isco is just something else, the talent is just jag dropping, while the maturity in which thiago plays makes won wonder if he is in his late 20's, and mendi is just a little alonso, just more mobile.

i know everyone believes their younsters are special especially the germans, but talent wise,gundogan,gotze and kroos has nothing on those three.
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Fey

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by Fey on Sat Jun 15, 2013 8:21 pm

Cant believe its still 0-0. Holland clearly the better team, though the football is abysmal.
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bluenine

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by bluenine on Sat Jun 15, 2013 8:38 pm

Azzurrini are struggling with the physical superiority of the Dutch. If I didn't know any better, I would have assumed this was 20 year olds playing some 15 year olds...

Italy's best bet is a goal on the counter, Gabbiadini is needed asap.
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bluenine

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by bluenine on Sat Jun 15, 2013 9:14 pm

Great skill by Insigne for the goal, cool finish by Borini. 1-0.

Now its up to the Inter boys to hold on...
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Luis

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by Luis on Sat Jun 15, 2013 9:45 pm

Kimbo wrote:Borini Laughok

cheers
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Fey

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by Fey on Sat Jun 15, 2013 9:50 pm

De Vrij and Martins Indi were faultless, van de Hoorn is terrible and he made a mistake as soon as he came on.  Hardly any football again, but then again, thats what you get with this midfield. Disgrace Clasie and Vilhena werent allowed to start..and to play Fer with an all nothing tactic..No
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Luis

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by Luis on Sat Jun 15, 2013 9:51 pm

That's the second time Borini has shat all over Kimmy this year.
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Kimbo

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by Kimbo on Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:42 pm

Luis wrote:That's the second time Borini has shat all over Kimmy this year.

2 massive goals.ok
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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by bluenine on Sun Jun 16, 2013 12:29 am

Italy will need to play a whole lot better in the final if they want to have a hope of troubling Spain... The midfield was non-existent tonight, the Azzurrini need one of Marrone or Saponara to be fit in time for the final.  

In attack, hopefully it will be Insigne behind Gabbiadini and one of Destro/ Borini/ Immobile.

Lets hope for a good game.
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bluenine

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by bluenine on Sun Jun 16, 2013 10:50 am

When you lose a game you’re always unlucky. But we didn’t deserve it today because we were the much better team,” Pot told uefa.com.

“It was a good game and we were the much better team. Only one team deserved to win and that was us.

“It’s very hard to take when you are the better team. I spoke to the players after the game and I congratulated on the football they played and their mentality, but it’s not always the team who deserves to win that does win.
”.

Anyone wants to know why Holland never win anything - that is why. Their coaches and players are always on denial. Its a perpetual state of burying their heads up each others asses and blowing smoke up there. Razz

But seriously, those kind of comments by the coach can't help the mentality of this next generation of Dutch players...

The dutch didn't take their chances, and they lost. They can have only themselves to blame.
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Super Progress

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by Super Progress on Sun Jun 16, 2013 1:36 pm

bluenine wrote:
When you lose a game you’re always unlucky. But we didn’t deserve it today because we were the much better team,” Pot told uefa.com.

“It was a good game and we were the much better team. Only one team deserved to win and that was us.

“It’s very hard to take when you are the better team. I spoke to the players after the game and I congratulated on the football they played and their mentality, but it’s not always the team who deserves to win that does win.
”.

Anyone wants to know why Holland never win anything - that is why. Their coaches and players are always on denial. Its a perpetual state of burying their heads up each others asses and blowing smoke up there. Razz

But seriously, those kind of comments by the coach can't help the mentality of this next generation of Dutch players...

The dutch didn't take their chances, and they lost. They can have only themselves to blame.
ok
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Pierre Littbarski

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by Pierre Littbarski on Sun Jun 16, 2013 2:24 pm

ok
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messiah

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by messiah on Sun Jun 16, 2013 3:52 pm

how does that show why. Holland never win anything, where they not intact the better team on the day. Holland don't win because the have a population of less than 20m and a messed up mentality
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Super Progress

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by Super Progress on Sun Jun 16, 2013 3:58 pm

bluenine wrote:
When you lose a game you’re always unlucky. But we didn’t deserve it today because we were the much better team,” Pot told uefa.com.

“It was a good game and we were the much better team. Only one team deserved to win and that was us.

“It’s very hard to take when you are the better team. I spoke to the players after the game and I congratulated on the football they played and their mentality, but it’s not always the team who deserves to win that does win.
”.

Anyone wants to know why Holland never win anything - that is why. Their coaches and players are always on denial. Its a perpetual state of burying their heads up each others asses and blowing smoke up there. Razz

But seriously, those kind of comments by the coach can't help the mentality of this next generation of Dutch players...

The dutch didn't take their chances, and they lost. They can have only themselves to blame.

messiah wrote:how does that show why. Holland never win anything, where they not intact the better team on the day. Holland don't win because the have a population of less than 20m and a messed up mentality
So you disagree and instead make to the very point Bluenine was making.scratch

Holland's problem has never been their low population because they have continually produced talent on the level of other big nations yet failed when it matters anyway so I don't see that an excuse.
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messiah

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by messiah on Sun Jun 16, 2013 4:53 pm

no i don't, they have a messed up mentality because they struggle to work as a group, not because they speak the truth about being a better team and being unlucky to close
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messiah

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by messiah on Sun Jun 16, 2013 4:56 pm

not everyone believes that if a team plays shit. on a stick football and score a goal, they deserve to win, its just a matter of fact that they did
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bluenine

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by bluenine on Sun Jun 16, 2013 9:10 pm

messiah wrote:no i don't, they have a messed up mentality because they struggle to work as a group, not because they speak the truth about being a better team and being unlucky to close

If you fuck up all the chances you create, you are not unlucky to lose - you got poor finishing. Football is not about who creates the most chances, its about who scores the most goals. I can understand being "unlucky" if you get a player sent off due to a bad decision, or get a goal due to a referee error... not when you are beaten fairly!

Dutch were not unlucky. And they certainly did not "deserve" to win that game. They got beat. If they want to improve, they first need to stop deluding themselves and face the reality. THAT, my friend, is the truth.
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Fey

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by Fey on Sun Jun 16, 2013 10:50 pm

Holland lost not because of the mentality, but because a lack of quality. Yes in the first half they were better then Italy. But only because they outmuscled Italy, which is all nice, but then you have the ball, but can't do fuck all with it. Thanks to a shite midfield and shite attackers. They were UNLUCKY to hit the post twice though. But in the 2nd half it was more even, and then a shite defender makes a mistake. Hence, lack of quality.

If Holland played footballers instead of destroyers, they would have most likely won, cause Italy was very, very poor. But not that it matters, Spain is ahead of everyone.

And the reason never wins a trophy has to do with the population, Holland has enough people to qualify the most of the times(compared to the likes of Croatia, Belgium, Sweden, Denmark etc), but is just simply too small to compete with the big boys all the time. Holland has a good first 11 every decade or so. But then it takes a few years again to reach that level. For example, now there a finally decent defenders coming through again, but is the attacking talent nowhere to be found. Compare that to Brazil who can field a good 44 or so. Or ditch a loser team every time they get knocked out . More or less the same for the other big nations. They only reason we could compete for such a long time, was a superior technical ability, however other nations like Germany and Spain also focus more on that, and thus we lose out thanks to a smaller pound to pick from.

Wtf is wrong with the quoting button btw.
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messiah

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by messiah on Mon Jun 17, 2013 12:26 am

no football is about entertainment. do you think people spend billions to see who scored the most goals. well maybe some a small minority.
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bluenine

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by bluenine on Mon Jun 17, 2013 1:23 am

messiah wrote:no football is about entertainment. do you think people spend billions to see who scored the most goals. well maybe some a small minority.

If football is about entertainment, then how can you support the tiki-taka snooze-fest that is 95% of Barca's football? Razz

Why not go for the spectacular "entertaining" pass instead of the 1 yard horizontal pass most of the time? Come on, surely even you acknowledge that Barca and Spain these days don't give a fuck about entertaining people, and focus only on winning...

btw, nobody spends billions. Expect maybe Roman and Moratti. Razz
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christmasborocooper

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by christmasborocooper on Mon Jun 17, 2013 1:30 am

Fey wrote:
Wtf is wrong with the quoting button btw.

Offtopic section...luis made a thread about it. Got a fix for it.
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Romford Pele

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by Romford Pele on Mon Jun 17, 2013 8:16 am

messiah wrote:its funny how  much the U21 plays like the senior team, even to the point where i have the same frustration with both, in that i want to see, a xavi iniesta link up in midfield for the seniors and thiago isco for the u21, but for the sake of defensive balance neither manager is doing so. it really grinds my gears.

isco,thiago and mendi has been a cut above so far, and morata is showing the same type of talent he did for the u19, a real gift for scoring goals, remains be of morientes.

isco is just something else, the talent is just jag dropping, while the maturity in which thiago plays makes won wonder if he is in his late 20's, and mendi is just a little alonso, just more mobile.

i know everyone believes their younsters are special especially the germans, but talent wise,gundogan,gotze and kroos has nothing on those three.

He's crazy good - like a cross between Iniesta and a false 9. So much talent there it's unreal. I pray he doesn't go to City.
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DD

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Re: U-21 European Championship 2013

Post by DD on Mon Jun 17, 2013 9:27 am

Super Mourinho wrote:
bluenine wrote:
When you lose a game you’re always unlucky. But we didn’t deserve it today because we were the much better team,” Pot told uefa.com.

“It was a good game and we were the much better team. Only one team deserved to win and that was us.

“It’s very hard to take when you are the better team. I spoke to the players after the game and I congratulated on the football they played and their mentality, but it’s not always the team who deserves to win that does win.
”.

Anyone wants to know why Holland never win anything - that is why. Their coaches and players are always on denial. Its a perpetual state of burying their heads up each others asses and blowing smoke up there. Razz

But seriously, those kind of comments by the coach can't help the mentality of this next generation of Dutch players...

The dutch didn't take their chances, and they lost. They can have only themselves to blame.
ok
Way to go to take the opinion of one loser to not only tarnish them over one entire country, but also identify it as one of the reasons for systematic failure.

The manager's comments are laughable. But so is the indication of his comments as one of the reasons of the countries failures. In all the years I followed football, that's the first time I hear it from a manager-type role or someone involved in Dutch football. From drunk fair weather punters and perhaps a clueless panelist yes, but show me one country who doesn't have those.
If anything the Dutch are brutal in their assessment of failure, don't blame the opponent, the referee, or penalties for that matter, yet always give the opponent their kudos. We only get up and try again. If anything they have too much a Calvinistic (sober) approach to things instead of being angry.
When you fail, you fail; football is not a game of chance. He's being rightfully laughed at.

You're way off.

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